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Mar 19, 08 - 12:03 am Comment from: NeverFade

very nice -

Mar 19, 08 - 12:17 am Comment from: TowerTone

"if Apple approves it, is what Narayen should have said."

ok, is that Flash, and a pan?....

Oh get off it already MDN. Flash is everywhere like it or not. It will be a huge plus for the iphone. I love Apple as much as the next guy, but worshipping Jobs like he can walk on water is getting really old. He can be wrong you know.

Mar 19, 08 - 12:29 am Comment from: grok

you'll be bootin' up Windows ME in hell for that one, durder...

durder,

Where exactly is MDN "worshipping" Jobs in their statement?

MDN is simply pointing out that Jobs may not allow distribution of Adobe's Flash player for iPhone/iPod touch through the iTunes Store.

@durder - MDN didn't say Jobs was right or wrong. If you're going to make an accusation, at least make some sense.

Mar 19, 08 - 12:33 am Comment from: amyhre

Personally I'd like to see the ability to block flash in Safari. If they irritate me and sometimes slow down a laptop/desktop computer, I hate to see what would happen on iPhone/iPod Touch.

durder=dunderhead

"We believe Flash is synonymous with the Internet experience, and we are committed to bringing Flash to the iPhone"

So is he saying that without Flash there wouldn't be any Internet? What a windbag.

Durder,

So what if Flash is "everywhere". There are enough sites out there that does not have Flash and are just working fine.

Mar 19, 08 - 12:57 am Comment from: Big Al

Flash is proprietary junk requiring license fees. If it doesn't work on iPhone it may not be everywhere for long.

You want to get your message to iPhone users? Drop Flash, it's that simple.

Mar 19, 08 - 01:14 am Comment from: The Other Steve

Steve may have a point. The iPhone feels snappy with Apple's finely tuned software on it. If you bog it down with every clunky plug-in available for desktop computers the iPhone may not be able to keep up.

I want a snappy, secure, and reliable iPhone. If it doesn't feel that way it will be Apple that will get the blame.

Apple will not limit Adobe's posting of an updated Flash. Perhaps the biggest news is in fact that Adobe is going to specifically develop a Flash variant for the iPhone. That is the real news, not whether or not Stevie boy is going to click the accept button.

…are they simply overlooking the fact that the SDK forbids downloaded applications from executing foreign interpreted code?

The man deceived his investors. He knows full well that Flash won't be on the phone just because Adobe implements it, and SJ has made it very clear that Apple's not interested. Also, anyone who reads the SDK's license agreement will see that any turing-complete interpreters won't be approved: that eliminates Flash, and Java.

-jcr

" Flash is everywhere like it or not. It will be a huge plus for the iphone."

Nope. It's a CPU-hog, and on the iPhone that's a bug, not a feature.

-jcr

So if Jobs does not wish it, then neither do his followers...

What if Adobe produces a good implementation of Flash?
What if Sun produces a good Java?

Surely these would be good things. I want flash in the browser. Plenty of sites out there use it, and so I would like it.

Java would be a welcome alternative to Objective-C, and would bring alot of programmers onboard.

These are GOOD THINGS.
Open you loving arms and EMBRACE new cool stuff for your iPhone. Don't go looking for reasons to limit yourself.

@MDN

"Given Steve Jobs' most recent statements about Flash.."

There are more ppl than Steve that makes descisions in Apple, Steve might have to concede, if other execs wants Flash in the iPhone, Flash *is* that important IMHO.

Mar 19, 08 - 04:26 am Comment from: Rainer

Bah!
Have mercy - no Flash please.
If it is anything like the Flash-player on PPC-Macs, it will require 80% of the available RAM and drain the battery in 23 minutes.
I really, really, really, really hope that Steve Jobs stays tough and firm on this one and makes it optional, difficult to enable and easy to switch off.
Flash is really the last thing I need on a phone, any phone - and especially the iPhone!
I'd rather have a (non-animated) Microsoft-startup logo.
OK, not quite that, but maybe a penguin or so

Mar 19, 08 - 04:50 am Comment from: iCesar

Durder... sorry to have to break this to yah: Jobs walks, runs and jumps, on water. Just so you know. So... No Flash For You! NEXT!!

Not having flash is one of the things that really attracts me to the iPhone and iPod Touch. Other than the occasional YouTube video or other video site I have no need for it. Even when I do use it I'd prefer not to. Since they have YouTube and with the new additions to Safari I really couldn't care less.

Mar 19, 08 - 05:40 am Comment from: It's About Time

Keep this crap off the iPhone, Adobe can't even get Flash 9.0.115 right on the Computer. How can they possibly get it right on the iPhone? SJ knows a bad Apple when he sees one.

One interesting turn of events is that for once, Sun and Adobe may assume their normal responsibility of providing their virtual machines and support for java and flash, resp.

IF these are approved by Apple, at least Apple has excellent leverage to insist on efficient implementations, instead of the inferior ports from some other platform.

Yeh, can you imagine Flash on the iPhone, you would also need to buy the additional heatsink and fan to bolt on the back of it, if Flash performance on my 2Ghz MacBook C2D is anything to go by.

I always wonder how Adobe can say Flash is good, when I can watch a full screen film in iTunes with no bother, but if I watch a 20 second clip on YouTube or iPlayer, the fans kick in after 5 seconds.

Make it lean Adobe, and maybe I might install it. Maybe.

Mar 19, 08 - 05:57 am Comment from: Tommy Boy

Okay Flash haters, please to explain why an optional Flash plug-in, assuming it met Apple's performance guidelines, that could be downloaded individually by users who have a need for such things, and avoided by those who don't want it, would be a bad thing?

Mar 19, 08 - 06:45 am Comment from: British Mac Head

Part of my job is creating Virtual Tours and without Java or Flash or QTVR I really can't demo them on my iPhone. I think Apple is a little naughty for not supporting QTVR like they used to. They rock for everything else they do but poorly supporting one of your own inventions is not good Apple.

Someone tell Steve please

Steve, Apple is a little naughty, now, go and tidy up your room.

Next!

It just dawned on me, Steve is not getting in bed with Adobe because he is holding out for...

Silverlight,

that's right, Steve wants the best, as usual


For the slow: this is a joke

Adobe will bend its back for this, they have no choice....at the end of the day, they're a software company...

All apple needs is a photoshop killer....

@ bioness
"All apple needs is a photoshop killer..."

Of course, that little nugget is right up there with saying something like, "All Apple needs is a cold fusion hardware device."

OK, I'm exaggerating, but you get my point.

flash is coming, so get over it...

It will be interesting to see if Adobe can make Flash perform somewhat decently. Frankly, I think most of Adobe's apps are very slow to load and perform. They seem to prefer adding features, some of which are of little use, rather than improving performance. I doubt Adobe can make a Flash player for the iPhone that won't bog it down.

Mar 19, 08 - 04:02 pm Comment from: Ampar

"Frankly, I think most of Adobe's apps are very slow to load and perform."

Acrobat Pro is a twitchy, buggy, slow piece of Muskox dung.

FLASH NEEDS TO BE ON THE IPHONE - Period. Apple advertises the iPhone has having a complete web browser... well's that's not completely accruate without flash. Anyone up for a class action law suit for false advertising?

This is good. Steve's harball with Adobe may have caused them to reprogram the bloat out of Flash. Good.

Ok...As much as I don't like bloated all-Flash sites, there are many tasteful and useful implementations of Flash on the net. It has some very good strengths as does CSS, AJAX, HTML, etc, and sure kicks the crap out of GIF animations (at least graphically) for most things. Primarily, using vectors in an animation vs. bitmap graphics is key for me...to just name one aspect. Every last Mac/PC you can buy in a store has the Flash plugin already installed. If you don't want to run the plugin or load banners, you don't have to - so stop crying! haha.

I do print work in addition to web design and have seen plenty of badly designed pdf's sent to me. Does that mean using pdf's is a bad practice? I've seen just as many poorly designed CSS/HTML websites, too.

Safari for iPhone was touted as a complete browser, but no Flash plugin simply means that statement was false. Not exactly what His Royal Steveness sold us on...it was supposed to be a "full version of Safari and Mac OS X".

We'll be seeing some cool new upcoming stuff by web developers like Animated CSS in the near future and hopefully it will be compatible with all browsers cross-platform. However, there are some things that can still ONLY be done in Flash. When there's a replacement for EVERYTHING it does, then it will go away or Adobe/Apple will relabel it or succeed it with the 'new thing'. I still have lots of clients that request Flash to be used in their websites, so the demand is there. Even if I feel there is an alternative for a certain function for what they want to do, they often tend to be stubborn about it, so I have to deliver Flash because they're paying the bill.

Flash is simply not going away for a while (unfortunately the same is true for IE, hehe).

E-mail me for release date it looks great I have been looking for adobe flash player but safari cannot download it. thankyou