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Nov 23, 09 - 03:04 pm Comment from: ericdano

Ouch. Verizon really can't do this? Can't do a phone call and use 3G at the same time.

That's gonna hurt.

Ahh it's like watching in-laws fight so much, you have the redneck family that is Verizon in which they are everywhere but can't do much with somewhat good looking kids,

And then snooty AT&T;bunch limited but has the means todo what ever and the beautiful children.. Ahh gotta love the holidays when everyone gets to share what they got and don't have.

and t-mobil is just a dirty whore that is well recognized.

Nov 23, 09 - 03:07 pm Comment from: dave smith

Who cares. Apple, open up the iphone to other carriers please it's time...

Nov 23, 09 - 03:08 pm Comment from: pwntbywombat

first of all, you can on a CDMA network send SMS messages while in a voice call. In fact, SMS messages send almost instantly when you are in a voice call because a connection to the tower has already been established. MMS messages on the other hand require use of the DATA network, and cannot be sent while in a voice session. next time someone wants to play down verizon, at least get your facts right. dumbasses

Nov 23, 09 - 03:09 pm Comment from: Deus Ex Technica

Wow!

Networks are are competing for mindshare on the basis of their network quality and availability rather than avail phones or silly add-on services.

This is as it should be. I guess "exclusive agreements" don't really stifle competition, do they?

Let the dumb-pipe wars (finall)y begin!

Nov 23, 09 - 03:10 pm Comment from: andintroducing

It's NOT call and data that are the killer counterargument, AT&T;and Apple. Most people don't think they'll use that (though they will). Te killer argument is calling and GPS DIRECTIONS at the same time. THAT has resonance as a convincing argument. Hated my original EDGE iPhone when I had to do only one or the other.

Directions may be data, but when you say data, few people will automatically think GPS. Most will think email or text and most people don't think they'd ever really want to do that.

Nov 23, 09 - 03:12 pm Comment from: andintroducing

That is most people don't think they will want to do calling and emailing or texting at the same time.

Fsck me, the iPhone can't possibly be coming to Verizon after this.

The dream is dead.

Nov 23, 09 - 03:14 pm Comment from: pwntbywombat

Agreed, I was using my iPhone on T-Slowble for a while, and it was a major pain in the ass not being able to take advantage of the UMTS radio inside the iPhone 3G. I have sence then switched to AT&T;, and with the added 850mhz coverage in my area I couldnt be happier.

Nov 23, 09 - 03:15 pm Comment from: pwntbywombat

TEXTING IS NOT DATA USAGE! ANY CARRIER CAN SEND SMS WHILE IN A VOICE CALL! JESUS F-ING CHRIST!

In the U.S.A. does somewhat now mean 'not very' instead of 'rather'?

Nov 23, 09 - 03:20 pm Comment from: HMCIV

Casting calls for the next set of ads:

"Hello I'm an iPhone."
"And I'm a Verizon..."

AT&T;3g is kind of slow because they have a lot of REAL DATA PHONES, I mean, iPhones. Verizon only have "little phones" with little crappy plastic keyboards that makes them very difficult to be use on the internet.

If you put the network traffic of AT&T;'s iPhones on verizon network, I bet you it crash. Just and AT&T;network crash with the first 3G iPhone

Nov 23, 09 - 03:31 pm Comment from: John

@andintroducing: I completely agree with your argument. Hopefully someone at Apple is thinking along these lines too.

And SMS folks: it's ALL DATA. Please be correct in your usage as well before getting so irate. Now the fact that CDMA can only do either "call" type data (eg voice and SMS) or 'internet' data (eg web browsing, MMS, email), but not both at the same time is correct. But in this age of all digital networks, there is no preordained, fundamental difference between any of these data types, merely in how they are handled by differing networks.

@R2

Some dream

Nov 23, 09 - 03:53 pm Comment from: iPhoner

Here's the commercials:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/23/apple-hits-back-at-verizon-in-new-iphone-ads-video/

Simultaneous voice calls & data? Who cares if you can't even make a call or get data coverage :S

Who cares? I mean, most of the time if I need to talk on the phone and use the web, I'll just walk over to my PC. If I'm not at a PC, it usually means I'm driving or standing in the middle of a public place where I wouldn't want to try to use the web or talk on a speaker phone.

If that's someone's make-or-break feature, they deserve the iPhone.

I'm using a Droid. It's openness has led to many more practical applications that Apple would never approve of, and have made the Droid much more useful to me than the iPhone ever was.

(Oh, and I'm a former iPhone user who went back to Verizon when the Droid was launched)

Nov 23, 09 - 04:15 pm Comment from: Predrag

..."you can on a CDMA network send SMS messages while in a voice call. In fact, (...) MMS messages on the other hand require use of the DATA network, and cannot be sent while in a voice session. next time someone wants to play down verizon, at least get your facts right. dumbasses"

Did you WATCH the ads? Not once did the commercial imply that SMS is only available on the iPhone? In the second one, the guy is looking up directions and is sending a MMS message. None of the things done in the commercial can be done on Verizon's CDMA network. Should I say "dumbass" now (considering you got your fact wrong)?

Nov 23, 09 - 04:19 pm Comment from: Predrag

Dan,

Well, I'm sure you have successfully convinced yourself that Droid does for you what iPhone doesn't. That is important, otherwise, you'd be kicking yourself for the next two years (now that Verizon has jacked up those early termination fees).

I don't think I'd ever want a phone that can't get online while I'm on the phone. Whenever I'm in traffic (bus, subway, walking the streets), I have my headphones on. When I'm not walking, my phone is in my hands and I'm doing something with it. It would be really a colossal hassle to have to stop doing what I'm doing when a call comes in. Conversely, it would be even bigger hassle to have to hang up before I can look at my e-mails, or google something while talking to someone. This is one of the most fundamental, common usages of a smartphone for an urban person. And Droid can't do any of them.

@pwntbywomba

It is not at all my intention to argue, belittle, or anything of the sort, and I will not be reading the thread again after I have responded to your interesting comment. You have shown yourself to be an extremely angry individual and one without personal peace, to invoke such BOLD-LETTER anger, hate, crudeness, and blasphemous charges against yourself with something so, in the grand scheme of things, frivolous as "texting vs data usage". Rather than lay the blame on Jesus Christ for whatever it is, deep down, that causes you to be so angry, why not look away to him as your own personal Savior. He died on a cross to pay the penalty for our sins, and rose from the dead three days later. Only he can give you peace. I know from personal experience, as I once was very much like you. Respectfully written.

Too bad they couldn't work Hodgman in somehow.

I was with Verizon four four years PRIOR to getting the iPhone, so I have no problems sticking with Verizon for two years. Seriously, how many people do you know that go from carrier to carrier every year?

The iPhone was OK...but only if I Jailbroke it. Now I can monitor torrents at home, make my own ring tones, and develop my own personal Droid apps without having to worry about a hacker coming up with the new Jailbreak after the latest OS release. To me, thats much more important than dual calling/web surfing.

To each his own, I guess.

The irony is that the company I work for is about to give me an iPhone for my company phone...so I'm going to end up back with both phones anyways.

I don't care about stupid ads. Apple and AT&T;need to do something very simple--provide usable coverage for this goddamned phone.

On Friday I needed to do a conference call with the court and four other attorneys. I arranged for it through AT&T;, who called my iPhone # rather than my land line. After my wonderful iPhone dropped the conference call THREE TIMES just while the operator was trying to get everyone on the line I got them to switch over to using my reliable Verizon line. I am not aware of a single call of 5 minutes or more that I have been able to make without Call Failed in weeks.

Call Failed when trying to dial numbers. Call Failed during calls. Phone messages showing up for calls I never got; that is, when I'm not getting Voicemail not Available.

I cannot wait for my AT&T;contract to end so I can go out to the Walnut Street bridge over to the University of Pennsylvania and toss my iPhone into the Schuylkill River.

Maybe I have a bad phone...who knows, because when I go to the AT&T;store and complain they just say, "everyone is having those problems."

Nov 23, 09 - 05:16 pm Comment from: HughB

@OpJ
First please register.
Second, The iPhone works great where I live, and if I lived in SF or NY I would get one of those wifi things that let me use my iPhone in my concrete tower. $150 will do it, that must be about 10 minutes of lawyer talk.
BTW I tried the Droid for 4 days. Pretty nice phone but it is no iPhone. Not even close. I was worried about my AAPL shares but not anymore.

@dave smith;

Crawl out from beneath the rock you're living under, won't you?
APPLE WENT to other carriers, the OTHER CARRIERS turned Apple down.

I'm happy as a bucket o' clams watching Verizon eat crow, losing likely a BILLION DOLLARS in revenue, because they've got no one but themselves to blame.

It's not data in the traditional sence. And yes, the article spacifically mentioned SMS. SMS does not require a data plan, and it doesn't require a data connection to send. Hence being able to send SMS messages while in a call whether it be GSM or CDMA.

the ATT ads SUCK big time..

not very good or creative..

the Verizon ads, on the other hand are quite memorable... and well done..

Nov 23, 09 - 05:59 pm Comment from: Cubert

OpJ,
I live in the Fairmount section and rarely get a dropped call.

All this is a much ado about nothing. No smartphone compares to the iPhone, and if you want an iPhone, you're getting ATT.

If you think a Blackberry, Droid, or other smartphone is "about the same" as an iPhone, you're deluded enough to think that it makes much difference which network you have.

Nov 23, 09 - 07:14 pm Comment from: twilightmoon

"Dan"
The irony is that the company I work for is about to give me an iPhone for my company phone...so I'm going to end up back with both phones anyways.

I think your whole series of posts is pure bullshit Astroturfing, but just in case you are really telling the truth, why would you feel secure on Android which has no security model (and very thin and massively fractured install base) and poo poo the iPhone's security? It's by far the most popular smartphone platform of all time and it has not seen a single exploit of any of its stock systems.

I don't really expect an intelligent answer, I guess I'm more wondering to myself, but perhaps you have a canned answer ready for my question provided to you by your employer. Is it Verizon or Motorolla that you work for? Or maybe even Google? Does Google pay Astroturfers?

Nov 23, 09 - 07:22 pm Comment from: twilightmoon

the Verizon ads, on the other hand are quite memorable... and well done..

I have to agree with you that the ads are well done. Too bad their network is utter shit, antiquated, crippled non-standard junk, far too slow and far behind the rest of the world.

Their customer service is so bad my dad's blood pressure went dangerously high recently trying to talk to the cretins that work there, and he's one of the most calm and reasonable people I've ever met in my life.

I just recently cancelled all the remaining Verizon accounts at my apartment (15+ years of land line and internet service) and my parents are discontinuing them at their second home in the mountains. We used to be all Verizon before the iPhone but their horrible service just pushed us over the edge. This is just the final straw.

I have never experienced a company as terrible and hateful to their customers as Verizon, it's just absolutely stunning, it's like they want you to go with their competitors. In fact ATT and other network providers should just cancel their ads and hire more Verizon customer representatives, they'd be far more effective means to get people to switch from Verizon than any TV ad.

Nov 23, 09 - 07:27 pm Comment from: twilightmoon

OpJ: Maybe I have a bad phone...who knows, because when I go to the AT&T;store and complain they just say, "everyone is having those problems."

You didn't say where you lived, but I'd raise holy hell. Write to the company, call customer service and ask to speak to supervisors, keep harassing them and let them know you plan to switch from them as soon as your contract expires, ask them if you can get out of your contract early due to bad service even.

I would not expect you to settle for substandard service for the iPhone, and ATT needs to get their act together, they work very well in some areas, but very badly in others.

I would however point out that Verizon if you think they are a salvation would get crushed by the iPhone if they were an exclusive carrier, they don't have the network to handle the huge demand for data that iPhone users soak up.

I hope ATT can fix the problems with their network, they are spending money on it but I'm not sure they are taking it seriously enough. If people like you keep raising hell, maybe they'll do something?

They work very well in Orange County (near Los Angeles) for me, and in the Lake Arrowhead mountains also (San Bernardino county mountains).

@twilightmoron

Astrosurfing?

Back in January I bought myself an iPod touch. I was so impressed that I ended up getting an iPhone 3G directly from the Apple Store in March.

I was very happy with the iPhone for awhile, but then I kept hearing about applications I'd love to have that wouldn't be approved by Apple. I tried Jailbreaking my phone for awhile, and that was cool, but being treated like a red-headed stepchild simply because I wanted to use an application that wasnt approved by apple really irked me. I was also tired of having to wait for the iPhone Dev Team to come out with another hack so I could safely update my iPhone.

The axe fell the day I wanted Google Voice. A lot of times I'm in meetings when I get important voice mails and the transcription would have been perfect. The fact I'm about to have two phones really made that something I wanted. The day I went to download it was the day Apple pulled it from the store. That was the last straw. I'm 38 years old and think that I am old enough to make decisions as to what apps I want to run. All I care about is that they're not malicious and they don't crash the phone.

Also, I was tired of owning an MP3 device that didnt simply allow me to connect it to a computer and listen to music directly off of the device. It's amazing that the iPhone doesnt do something as esoteric as that.

Its simple, The Apple Way isnt MY WAY. You may think Apple is providing the best experience, but it's not for me.

The Droid is perfect for me. I mean I can pick an MP3 on my Droid and select a menu option that says, "Make into Ringtone" really says a lot about the Droid, and that's only the start of the things I've been able to do that Apple blocked me from doing on the iPhone.

I keep a spare battery with me...I upgraded the memory by using a MicroSD card...more things I could not do with the iPhone. (although I did get around the battery issue by buying an expensive Mophie Juice pack that added considerable weight and bulk to the phone).

Maybe you guys like the hand-holding, but I certainly do not. Especially as a developer.

And finally, I'll end up with an iPhone anyways because that is what my company uses as their company phone. Right now I'm contracting and will become perm in January.

in my humble opinion, both ATT and Verizon suck.