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They had those on the refurbished page a while ago...

perfect timing...

*Walks to apple store*

I've said it before & I'll say it again:

Apple Certified Refurb is the only way to buy. I'm on my third PowerBook and my iPod 60GB was a refurb, too. No issues and they're really just like new. I use the extra money for RAM and other extras.

About ready to make the jump to MacBook Pro...

MacBook Pro's are a waste of money for the price.

1: 32 bit processors, no Firewire 800 , limited connectivity and expansion

2: To get anything out of them you have to max the RAM and get a 7,200 RPM hard drive. No good 3D gaming.

3: Lose it, drop it, drive off with it on the roof of your car, leave it in the hot sun, stolen etc...

4: $4500 tricked out with AppleCare.

5: Only good for 2-3 years and then it's done or obsolete.


Better to buy a Quad, the next grade up video card, Apple care, 4GB of RAM and a cheap monitor for just about the same price.

1: It will be more than twice as powerful, it's expandable, upgrade as you go.

2: All software is ready for it as well as future software (universal binaries)

3: The life of the machine is longer 5-7 years of good solid use

4: 3D game and run full blast on anything, multiple apps etc.

5: Total yearly cost of ownership is lower.

6: Buy a cheap MacBook refurbished or a G4 laptop for under $1000.

wait for the laptops with Core 2 Duo!

wait for the laptops with Core 2 Duo!

I agree.


BPI reassures consumers: “We will not sue you for filling your iPod with music you have bought yourself"

http://www.bpi.co.uk/index.asp?Page=news/press/news_content_file_1002.shtml

scroll down for the anouncment (and the UK goes wild tonight)

Static Mesh/Mac Dude clone,

I can't believe your write again the same idiocy. I own a Quad AND a PBG4 and you know what, I'm planning on upgrading to MBPro. Do you know, friend?

BECAUSE I CAN'T LUG THE QUAD AROUND THE WORLD WHEN I TRAVEl!

GOT THAT?

Now stop wasting MDN space with your nonsense!

Hey Mesh, you're absolutely right! You've convinced me. I'm buying a quad, lots of ram, maybe two cheap monitors, a three man crew of unemployed homeless people at minimum wage and a long extention cord. Add one of those luggage trollies and I can go anywhere!

And the multi-media capabilities of the MacBook Pro are just horrible for that $4500 too, I may add.

I can have three TV windows, a DVD movie, iTunes visuals in a window, a animated screen-saver as the desktop and a 3D video game all going on AT ONCE on my Duallie 2.

I can only imagine what I could do with a Quad and the latest video card.

Don't shortchange yourself, a MBP is just a overpriced status symbol.

MDW: "used" MacDude was used and abused by the graphics art establishment, too much chemicals in the darkroom. Be glad you got Photoshop.

BECAUSE I CAN'T LUG THE QUAD AROUND THE WORLD WHEN I TRAVEl!

And what do you seriously expect that $4500 overpriced, underpowered 32 bit processor machine to do for you?

1: You really can't do video too much because the hard drive is too small and slow, forget HD. Forget dragging tons of equipment to make it somewhat usable. Forget most audio too. Forget dragging a larger monitor.

2: You really can't 3D game because the video card is lame and hobbled because of heat issues.

3: You can't use Photoshop well because it's not Intel ready yet nor much of anything else.


So your stuck really being able to do much of anything "professional performance grade" on it. So your going to use it to then get online, email and perhaps iChat, watch a few DVD's, run a few spreadsheets.

You can use the cheap G4 or MacBook for that. Then when I come to rob you, you only lose $1000 instead of $4500 MPB.

It's STUPID to buy a MacBook Pro at this time. The batteries are swelling, it's hot, there's too much thermal paste on the processors etc.

Wait for rev 2 if your so hot to throw away $4500 dumbarse.

Static Mesh,

If it's no good for HD and streaming video, how come my fellow professional video editor just cranked out a big edit on his MacBook Pro 15"?

While I agree that waiting for revision 2 is a good idea, the current models run slightly faster than our Dual 2.5 G5s. Now my friend did say that he wished he had waited for the 17" MacBook since it DOES HAVE FIREWIRE 800, contrary to what you stated...

Photoshop runs at least as fast on the MacBook in rosetta as it does on my 1.33 GHz G4 Powerbook.

Mac users don't use their computers for games, Photoshop not being Universal is not the MacBook Pro's fault and your rant about forgetting audio and video is just plain ignorant.

Yes there will be some professionals that need more power, they are waiting for the new "Power Mac" or whatever Apple will be calling it. For now people who need Photoshop to run at top speeds and need the raw power for Final Cut Pro will use a Power Mac G5. End of story.

In the meantime if you need a reliable, "portable" computer, the MacBook Pro is just fine. Will it get substantially better with the next generation... of course, that's just common sense. If you don't like the MacBook Pro don't buy one, but don't bash other people who need a portable computer right now.

And your argument that they will last only 2-3 years is just plain wrong and, quite frankly, ignorant. I still have a PowerBook G3 that runs OS X Tiger just fine. Is it slow yes, but it works and if all you need it for is E-mail and websurfing and Office work... it is a champ. Oh, and I bought it 6 years ago.

Yo mesh.
Why don't you take like a week off from posting here huh?

Sounds like you've got a killer set up, can't you find something better to do?
I dunno, maybe,
work?

Most of us did think a little bit about what we needed when we placed our orders.

But thanks for letting us know we were all so freaking wrong.

Maybe you could write a letter to Steve Jobs to tell him to stop selling people things YOU don't need. We'll just ignore all the other "useless" opinions around here.

Thanks Buddy.
Oh hey, what's your high score?
Mine's $13.702.44 USD for the last gig with my POS Powerbook as an essential tool... I mean "crutch"

Huh! Magic word is "art" I'll be dammed. Jackass

Static Mesh. Dude.

"MacBook Pro's are a waste of money for the price."

http://tranchant.plus.com/notes/apostrophe

Those are great deals. I picked up a MacBook Pro 1.83Ghz months ago for $1699 and I'm super happy with it.

If I didn't somtimes play games, I'd totally jump on that black MacBook.

MacBookPro = beachballs and Dock bounces


I see no beachballs on my 3 year old duallie 2, RAID O as boot, 5 GB of RAM, oh you can't put more than 2 GB in your MBP? hehehehe.

Buffering to the hard drive all the time are you, beachball, work, beachball, work. LOL

Can I record UNCOMPRESSED HD, oh yes I can. I get 165 glorious MB per second writes.

No, I'm afraid we are quite safe from your FRIENDS here.

Commander, you may fire at will.

Static Mesh, do you have a blog or something? You are so awesome! I want to read everything you have to say, not just about Macs. Can I buy a shirt with your photo on it or something?

Look

Dont get me wrong, I'm not saying the MBP is a bad computer, I'm just saying it's not worth the $4500 to make it something one can use.

My argument is it's better to get a monster Quad which is expandable at the same price of $4500 and then get a light powered Mac for the portable use.

I have seen SO MANY MacHeads take their Powerbooks and turn them into desktop machines, they realized too late that should have gotten a PowerMac instead because 99% of the time the PowerBook sits on their desk!!!

And contrary to what most think, the PowerMac G5 is semi portable, provided you have the right metal foam case to carry it in.

Professional road editors do it all the time, in a few minutes they are all set up on their PowerMac Quad and cranking video.

One guy I know has modified his metal case so he doesn't have to take the PowerMac G5 out of it!!!!

The 30 " monitor is attached to the lid of a case!!! and the keyboard/mouse is in the bottom part!!!

now that's a video road man!

So you see the MPB is not the optimal choice for the money that's all I'm trying to say.

Static Mesh,

MBP's start at $1999 and you can get refurbs for $1549. Whats with quoting MBP's at $4500 and then quoting MB's at $1000. A bit sensationalistic, my friend.

Static Mesh = Pure bull$hit.

I use MBP's all day long for video production...they are becoming major workhorses for me, and providing a good living.

Andrew Hamilton
Video Production Las Vegas
http://www.hiproductions.com

<i>MBP's start at $1999...</b>

Have you ever used a $1999 MBP?

5400 RPM slow pig of a hard drive and 512K of RAM?

MPB 17 2GB, 7,200 RPM, AppleCare = $3448 pre tax US

Quad G5stock, AppleCare =$3548 pre tax US


The Quad is twice as powerful and many times more expandable

1: up to 16GB of RAM

2: upgrade video card, 3D gaming

3: larger drives and faster 10,000 RPM SATA drives, SCSI and Fiberchannel too. RAID O as boot. (zoom!)

4: upgrade monitor to 30", many 30"ers if you want.

5: 64 bit processors, not 32 bit like MBP Core duo's.

I had Apple laptops for many years and finally wised up to the scam.

Let's stop feeding the troll, shall we. It seems to give him a belly ache.

Life lesson: Buy what you want and be happy with it. And, ignore the tool.

Let me break down the math for you.

It's cheaper in the long run to upgrade a Quad over it's 5-7 year lifespan than it is to replace a MBP every 2-3 years.

With the Quad one better weathers software upgrades from hobbling their machines.

Slap in more RAM and faster drives and she zips.

Since both a MBP and a Quad are about the same price, the value is with the Quad.

Lowest yearly TCO. Plus the Quad is twice as productive until the MBP performance comes up, if it ever can. (heat problems)

Relentless.

I use MBP's all day long for video production...they are becoming major workhorses for me, and providing a good living.

Holy crap, I haven't worked that cheap in ages. No wonder your busting yo ass.

Man I just negotiated a $20,000 insurance construction repair job, all I really needed was a MB and Appleworks, but I guess it's overkill I used my duallie 2 and 30"

But then I guess for what you do a MBP is underkill, hahaha ain't life funny like that?

Hey, I livened up the thread, sue me.

Want some free Jam Packs? found some on this site

http://www.macjams.com/article.php?story=20050720210221453


9000 free fonts here

http://www.creamundo.com/index.php?lang=en

"512K of RAM"

Are you running a REALLY striped down version of OS X (lol)? You must give me the recipe...

stripped

Hey, where did all the Static Mesh posts go? I can't see any of them.

Funny Joy of Tech!!

http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyarchives/836.html

and another

http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyarchives/832.html

I kind of agree with StaticMesh on one point. I bought a last gen 12"PB G4 and ended up keeping it on my desktop with my 20" LCD. I traded it in on a refurbed dual 2ghz powermac g5 and haven't regretted it once. (other than it having a 9600 memory card with only 64meg of ram.

For daily computing at work, I'm using a generic (groan) windows laptop. 2.2 ghz p4m, 512 meg ram, 30 gig hd, and 32 meg integrated graphics. It has xp home. Spyware, adware, etc are manageable as long as i don't use internet explorer and run spybot and adaware EVERY day.

The no name is sufficient for my work, as much as I am itching to go out and buy a macbook. Under this scenario I cannot justify the expense (sigh). I've heard at least three mac commandments over the years on this forum:

I. Thou shalt buy a new system if thou needs it, otherwise thou shalt wait.
II. Thou shalt not buy a version A Mac product if thou canst help it.
III. Thou shalt not become vexed if the Steve thy Jobs releases a new improved system within a fortnight of thou buying one.

Myself, I'm hoping that my fifth grader needs a decent computer for school so I can give her the then three year old laptop and buy a core2duo macbook with 10.5.

(Sigh) I HATE being responsible...

For me, the MBP works great. I need Windows here at my mega-corp office and I plug into my 21" Dell monitor. I put Windows XP on my external and run my Mac apps on my 1440x800 MBP screen.

At meetings, I have plenty of realestate to run any apps I need to. People here are constantly amazed at what I can do with this. It's the most compatible machine ever made.

Sure the G5 has great engineering. Sure my MBP gets hot, but it never bothers me. I'm sure I could clock up the GPU and it's be fine. Yes I run it on my lap for extended periods.

If you need portability and flexibility a G5 is not for you. If you are uni-focussed on HD compression rates, then go get yourself a "dualie".

I suspect my lowly MBP will be upgradable to a faster processor through a mail-in service when I'm ready for it, just like my 12" PB is. It doesn't look like any more G5s are being built.

Besides, the liquid cooling systems are starting to wear out and leak.

So wether your name is Mesh or Noraa, your favorite computer may not be right for someone else. I spent $2000 for this one and I'm jealous for the $1549 deals out there now. Get what's right for you.

I kind of agree with StaticMesh on one point. I bought a last gen 12"PB G4 and ended up keeping it on my desktop with my 20" LCD. I traded it in on a refurbed dual 2ghz powermac g5 and haven't regretted it once

Why thank you Clyde, nice to see a fellow machead who understands the point I'm trying to make.

I was the same like you, always buying expensive Apple laptops because I thought I needed to be showing off to people. Then one day I tripped over a cord (not the G3's) and that sweet machine (at the time) went flying and I watched helplessly as over $3000 shattered on my kitchen tile floor.

If one has the money to burn for a MBP or absolutley needs it, then hey go for it. But it's not a good value and it's risky.

A desktop pro machine is immensly better than any laptop and if a cheap Mac or PC will do for the road then do that.

I'm just trying to get people to understand and make a rational decsion concerning their computer usage.

Your point was made about 50 posts ago. It's your relentlessness in trying to get people to agree with you that's the issue. Not everyone shares your values or priorities. State your point, then move on.

Have you ever bothered to ask what makes it so important for people to agree with you?

I still say that the MacBook Pro beats the Quad G5 hands down at being a laptop computer. Call me crazy, just don't call me Static MacDude.

Static Mesh = Dvorak???

Sounds like the same formula... piss of the Mac faithful and have hours of fun defending your pissition.

StaticMesh, I'm not trying to rub it in, but I don't really get your comment. First of all, the MBP's are laptops, portable machines made for travel, why compare them to apple's full fledged professional desktop machine (maxed out with 4gb of RAM)? Secondly, a MPB is not $4500, even with apple care, I don't know where you got that figure. And according to this article, you can get a really good bang for your buck deal with these refurbs. And finally, the MBP's are very capable machines, maybe they're not "insanely great" for a pro gamer/graphics guru like yourself (?) but tests have come out of them running Half LIfe 2 and other graphic intensive games (under XP) very well, and sometimes better than any rival pc laptop. They actually offer an excellent balance of power and portability. "Lose it, drop it, drive off with it on the roof of your car, leave it in the hot sun, stolen etc..." huh? perhaps you should get rid of every portable consumer electronic you have then (ipod, ds/psp, watch, etc etc...) Anyway, drinking too much coffee? It happens

Anyone with a brain knows that there is a price premium for getting a laptop, therefore, you can get a higher performance desktop for the same amount of money. You are also conveniently forgetting to add the cost of that low end laptop to your calculations. So in the end, you will pay a lot more for both a laptop and a desktop than for one or the other.