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Jul 08, 08 - 10:33 am Comment from: Jamie

So who was listening in on this "private conference call"?

Good for Apple. Glad to hear they still keep the customer's in mind.

How does this benefit the customer or Apple for that matter ... still far too expensive to deal with Rogers ... so not many phones will be sold ... how about a different carrier ...

those unlocked usa phones are looking pretty good right now

Good for Apple!!!
It's the right call, keep the pressure up on Rogers.....

I would say boycott the 'Blow Jays' at Rogers centre, but I think think anyone watches or cares about them anyways...
(I can't change the channel away fast enough on TSN from the Jay highlights with an empty Skydome in the back ground)

But I digress!! BOYCOTT ROGERS!

Rogers is renamed Robbers in Canada.

i meant 'I dont think anyone watches' the Blue Jays....

I 'Blew' that one, LOL

It's Canada, who cares?

Canada is the United States' hat. Inconsequential, at best.

I currently have a $45 plan with Rogers for 350 minutes (actually 700 minutes, signed up on promotion). According to Rogers, who collapsed under the pressure, I can use my existing plan with the iPhone, but since it has no data, I would need to add a data option.

Here they are:
- $15 for 2.5MB
or
- $40 for 12.5MB

Their $30 for 300MB option isn't available to me because I signed up on promotion.

If I gave up my promotion in order to get a reasonable data package, my daytime minutes would drop from 700 down to 150, and I'd still be paying more.

I also have unlimited WAP browsing on my account for an extra $20, but they still charge me for WAP browsing at 5¢ per KB. Go figure.

The same would apply if I purchased the iPhone. Go figure. Just can't win.

This is exactly, and I mean exactly, what socialistic ideals take a country and its people. It reduces competition, and creates monopolies - among hundreds of other piss poor results.

I don't mean to get on the political bandwagon, but tis the season... I can't imagine our health-care system being put into the hands of the Federal government...

In state after after state - even the GOP's own Mitt Romney's plan in Mass - are all nearly bankrupt or heading there - all socialized medicine plans.

Here's a thought - get government OUT of the way of competition, and not regulate and be lobbied to death on these issues by big companies covered over with talk to the masses of idealism. Please...

As a very famous President once said "The scariest words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help." Ronald Reagan.

Do yourself a society a huge freedom favor this political fall season and vote for the people running for office who are not proposing the government as the salvation for all our ills.

RE: MacDailyNews Take: We often use "Canada's Rogers" in headlines, but we're really beginning to think we have it backwards. Why not just rename the country "Rogers," eh, Canucks?

Leave it to Apple to begin fixing Canada's monopoly quagmire where Canada's lawmakers and regulators (do you have any up there?) have failed their country miserably,...

They are just following the lead of amerikans again... seeing as Apple has been trying to fix amerikas/Microsofts monopoly quagmire for decades... where are amerikas lawmakers and regulators (do you have any down there?) they have failed their country miserably since Bush gave MS a free pass... among many other Bush related failures....

(sigh) amerikans.... always ready to point a finger yet fail to see there own shortcomings

Jul 08, 08 - 10:50 am Comment from: MikeK

"but shouldn't Apple either agreed beforehand on reasonable rates or not done a deal with Rogers in the first place?"

----------------

Yes, and whether Apple agreed with the pricing or not, they knew very well what Rogers rates were going to be beforehand.. This is nothing but a PR move to make Apple look good..

@Begs the Question

Go away please.

First of all Canada is an awesome huge country, even bigger than the US and cold too, so frankly mobile phones are not really a lot of fun when it is minus 20 below (that's Celsius of course).

Second, while Canada does have lawmakers and regulators, as anyone who can use google will know. However, it has something a lot better than that, people that care, and many Canadians have petitioned Rogers and certainly that must have impressed Apple Computers cause they have done something about it. Maybe the rest of their country will follow suit. That certainly would be refreshing for while there are lots of so called American regulators and law makers it certainly is for show, considering this is a country that tortures people and goes off into illegal war without much of a quibble from the people, who are usually too busy badmouthing others in a feeble attempt to distract others from their own stench.

So good on Apple for taking note of the power of the Canadian people.

I hope their shares take a hit from this development!
They deserve it!!!!

@ begs the question

Canada is not the USA's "hat."

Canada is a lot bigger than the USA and it's sandwiched between tiny Alaska and the continental states. In that sense, it's probably more accurate to say that Alaska is Canada's "hat" and the USA is "Canada's pants."

And if the USA is pants, we all know what Florida must be.

Jul 08, 08 - 10:57 am Comment from: auren

Sigh... not to start yet another pissing contest across our respective border, but it sure is tiresome reading MDN's comments on Canada's legal system, economy, weather, morales ... etc. etc. etc. and how totally lacking we are up here compared to the great and wonderful USA.

Take off, eh !!

Jul 08, 08 - 10:57 am Comment from: stormy

Apple needs to find a new carrier for Canada. Roger's will still make money off the suckers that go with their inflated plans.

Jul 08, 08 - 10:58 am Comment from: theloniousMac

re: "RE: MDN's Take"


Whoever you are, as far as MDN's take, it's insulting for sure, but if anyone should be using the socialist "K" in the spelling of their country's name, it's Kanada.

I would love to see a Roger's phone bill and add up all the surcharges and taxes to see just how much of that Roger's gets to keep. I'd also like to see how much taxes Roger's has to pay in general to remain in business.

Someone is paying for all that "free" health care.

That's what happens when you sell out for subsidies and give the carriers control over your product.

As soon as Steve Jobs went for the subsidy and signed his soul on the dotted line, he lost his leverage at the negotiating table and the iPhone became just like any other handset.

This never would've happened if he stuck with the model of the 1stGen and helped break the carriers' backs rather than buddy up to them.

Jul 08, 08 - 11:01 am Comment from: Wandering joe

Hope they do the same in Dk. (Apple not Rogers)

@Steven - Socialism 101

You twit! Try reading a bit about the political structure of a nation before you touch a keyboard. We are not the US of A. We do not have a forced 2/4 year election cycle. The cell phone operators are business enterprises, not government agencies, though they are subject to government oversite as are US providers. Our government is doing the right thing by NOT getting involved. Where did you get the confused notion that they were?

This is a battle that is being fought in and by the marketplace. Consumers have a right to not purchase a product if the value is not seen to exceed or equal the price charged. Rogers or the consumer will "win" based solely on that.

54 40 or fight, you wanks.

Jul 08, 08 - 11:05 am Comment from: jarrettdailynews

I can say pretty certainly, that Apple would not have known what Rogers rate plans would have been. Contractually, I am sure that Rogers was expected to offer a "fair" deal for the consumer. Now compare the iPhone plans with Rogers data plans a year ago. You are getting a fair deal as far as Rogers sees things. You Canadians wanted a better package, you got a better package. Now, either buy the phone or don't.

I love capitalism, "you are selling a product that I don't have to buy, but if I do buy it you are expecting me to pay how much??"

Communismada

Nice country you all have there. "I want all the benefits of a fair marketplace, but I want to dictate to you how much you can charge me for your own product."

The revisionism is incredible. Apple hasn't done anything. Rogers still gets to sell the iPhone at their stores and should they not have enough to go around (which I doubt will be the case), they can make up for a lack of supply with the slew of iClone manufacturers knocking at the door.

This move is like Obama saying he'll vote for FISA and then issuing that dumb ass, patronizing statement to humble his blind supporters. In the end he's still voting for it.

They shouldn't be called Rogers, but Rogered, because Canadians are being Rogered.

its not up to Apple ... as much as I dont agree with Rogers, I disagree with APPLE. It sure means Apple just dont want to help the loyal customers.
They have given up... You support that? I don't! I say boycott both!

Interesting but Rogers rates page has once again changed.

You can now simply have a phone plan and add a data plan. I am a big proponent of Flex plans when you have absolutely no idea how much voice/data you may chew through. Once you establish benchmarks, then you can choose specific plans. These rates are for Corporate/Business.

Rogers (Business Plans)

VOICE
"Right Fit Plan" ($25 - $85)
$25 for 250 minutes (for every 150 minute increase it's $15 or $85 for 1000 minutes)

DATA
"Flex Rate Plan" ($50 - $100)
$50 for 500GB ($65 for 1GB, $75 for 2GB, $85 for 3GB, $100 for 5GB)

VALUE PACKS
$15 Smart Phone Value Pack
Call/Name Display
Enhanced Voice Mail
2,500 Text Msgs
1,000 sent Video/Picture Messages (If Apple adds MMS)
WhoCalled feature (if your phone is turned off you can still see who tried to call)
Mobile Backup

So basically the flex plan would range from $90 (250 minutes, 500MB, Value Pack) to $200 (1,000 minutes, 5GB, Value Pack)

(AT&T;Business plan would be $45 for Unlimited Data + $15 for 1,500 Text Msgs. in addition to the voice plans for business that start at $40ish for 450 minutes for an entry total of $100. Upper end shows voice at $155 for 3000 minutes or $200 for 6000 minutes plus the $60 for data and text or $205 and $260 respectively)

Keep in mind that 5GB of data is far more that would be exceeded by heavy heavy data users. Most iPhone users today use about 300MB/month and with the 3G, even tripled is under 1GB. I'm not advocating Rogers' pricing at all, BUT it does appear they have changed their stance and now allow you the option to build up your packages as well.

Obviously, the petition has caused at least some change!

Jul 08, 08 - 11:13 am Comment from: mike k.

Steven: This is exactly, and I mean exactly, what socialistic ideals take a country and its people.

i'm sure this sounded really good in your head ...

on the bright side it nicely prefaced the intelligibility of the rest of your comment.

Actually, that was my phrase - but the point remains - we should have pressed on to 54 40.

Yours Kindly,

James K. Polk

I just want to buy the iPhone without a data plan. I don't care to use the internet everywhere i am but i do want everything else the iPhone has to offer. Even better if iPhone was easily unlockable as i plan on traveling to parts of Asia later. Sadly, i doubt this dream situation will ever be available.

I love it when uninformed americans pipe up on matters they don`t have any background knowledge in. Before you make comments regarding other countries (no matter which ones) please do your homework! I`d love to have an open intelligent discussion but drop the socialist crap and the "government control" tripe! Try doing some research or reading some history (war of 1812, Canadians burned the white house down, I know for a fact that is not openly taught in American history classes) or try visiting our country you might like it (My American friends do)

Education+appreciation=intelligent dialogue

Sorry to my informed and patient American friends

My Toronto Canada-based business owns numerous Macs and while they initially cost more than Windoze machines, they have a lower cost after only 6 months (and yes I've done the numbers - Windows machines require more staff, hours and downtime.) Our Apple machines have zero downtime. Zero.

So we tossed out our last Dell six months ago and are 100% Macs now.

The Apple iPhone under the Rogers promises only increased costs over our Blackberries with little additional functionality in the tasks we most use our Blackberries for. (cellphone, email & text messages).

Nope... I love Apple and I probably would have phased in iPhones for all had the Rogers plans been competitive.

So, not this year. We'll see what happens next year, but if the Rogers rates remain the same and they remain the only iPhone network, Apple aren't going to sell any iPhones to me and I suspect to many other businesses.

Wow, I just checked the list and Apple has a whopping SIX STORES in Canada!

LMAO! They're really sticking it to the man here. Atta boy, Stevie.

Yes it WOULD be interesting to see who listened in on this 'private conference call'!

Perhaps Apple was unable to interface with Roger's systems to sign customers up for mobile contracts, and that's why they aren't carrying them in the stores?

Too bad, seems as though this would be the first Apple product not to be sold in their own stores.

It is sad and unfortunate for the Canadian consumers who have all the while been looking forward to owning iPhone 3Gs, come the 11th of July. But, they should be thankful to Apple for stopping them from being molested and put on a 3-year's Rogers-bondage. And all should be blamed on the greed, arrogance, insensitivity to the needs of the consumers and the get rich attitude of Rogers administration. It sees a windfall in the impending iPhone 3G sales.

Similar "monsters" of operators are still abound, be it from New Zealand, Scandinavia or Southern Europe.

A change of mind-set on the part of Rogers is needed for a better solution! Rogers, you need a base of happy, satisfied and loyal customers, don't you? Do something, NOW! Yes, you can!

Jul 08, 08 - 11:20 am Comment from: Jaimie Harris

So if Apple are being tough with Rogers in Canada, could they also be tough with O2 in Ireland, Sonera (I think) in Finland and myriad others.

O2 in Ireland are offering 1GB monthly data on all three packages and no Visual Voicemail despite O2 UK offering unlimited data and Visual Voicemail. Oh yeah, according to them we're "freaks" so we will pay through the nose.

Yes, the healthcare system in the US is a far better system [rolls eyes] and the US taxpayers are free of the burden of paying for any of it too... [smirk] "yanks" are so funny, never seeing the forest for the damn trees. Keep believing your own fables and maybe one day they may come true...

Some americans rely on a cult-like worship of their country yet are in complete denial of the facts, thus are reduced to flag-waving, finger pointing, zealous bigotry and outright lying to appear superior.

I agree with the MDN take - Rogers are a bunch of greedy idiots, BUT I am shocked that Apple let this happen in the first place!!!!!!!!!!

Rogers will not get my business until they offer plans with more bang for the buck!

at the end of the day
its not up to APPLE to decide whether the price is too high.
its up to the CONSUMER. let the consumer decide whether or not they want to spend the $$$ on the rate plans. Apple charges a premium for there products already! Its up to the consumer whether they want to waste there money or not. When did Apple become the court in lowering prices or saying what is fair? If Steve Jobs wanted to make the phone cheaper he could have... Wait he did... No more metal body... plastic body.

kwalos, have you bothered to read the article?

The iPhone is still being sold all across Canada by Rogers and its affiliated stores. Apple only pulled units from its six Apple retail stores.

They haven't stripped Canadian customers of anything except the chance to buy the iPhone in their nice, sterile Apple stores. All six of them.

Rogers - Canada
R.I.M. - Canada
Co-incidence?

Jul 08, 08 - 11:35 am Comment from: Macintosh Sauce

ahahahahahahahahaha

apple only has 6 stores in Canada. Not enough for the demand for the iPhone...
i dont think they can handle the amount of volume the Rogers stores can... i think in Toronto (downtown core) there are about 50 plus rogers outlets... I think its in Apples best interest not to sell the iPhone and let it go through Rogers.

That's such a ballsy move! No other company in the world would do such a thing.

Jul 08, 08 - 11:51 am Comment from: ron

Rogers. Canada = Upper U.S.

In the meantime, Bell and Telus are charging for incoming text message.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=2527e80a-6260-47fb-b5ed-441d51cc0b79

"Cellphone users are about to be hit with new fees as two of Canada's telecommunications giants plan to bring in a levy on incoming text messages.

Bell Mobility will begin charging customers 15 cents per incoming text message on Aug. 8. Telus Mobility is moving to the same billing practice effective Aug. 24. Until now, their pay-per-use customers who send text messages have been charged a 15-cent fee per message, but it hasn't cost anything to receive them.

The pending new charge has sparked outrage on blogs, with customers saying they can't control who sends them messages, especially when spammers obtain their cell number or retailers send them unsolicited messages."

On one side, they are reducing Data plans, and on the other side, they are increasing text message fees.

Jul 08, 08 - 11:54 am Comment from: Goople

all the more reason for the software/tech industry to invest in ubiquitous WiMax...think iPod touch....

worldwide broadband funded by tech companies would present a strong competitor to traditional carriers.

Hey, aside from being heavy on the American 'wingers, we seem to have a decent delegation of Canadians and Brits on the boards here, so a little poll in honor of Steven:

Here, we pay out of our paychecks in one way or another for insurance that includes most if not all of the following caveats:
still comes with copays,
restricts doctor/hospital choice (even in emergency),
reserves the right to retroactively decide that covered care wasn't covered,
has by far the most expensive drug prices in the world,
doesn't cover mental health,
doesn't cover preventative health,
doesn't cover dental care,
may not cover medication,
may not accept you based on existing or previous conditions,
results in lower life expectancy and higher infant mortality than most other 1st world nations...
and still leaves almost 50 million of us entirely without coverage of any kind at all.

And all this at only twice the cost per capita based on the median of other developed nations. The only reason our "system" isn't bankrupt is that there is no recognizable system to evaluate in those terms.

How many of you who live under the heavy hand of socialized medicine would give up your state health care programs in favor of our fantastic American system?

I'm proud of my country in so many ways that it has earned- it's my duty to honestly face it's decifiencies so they may be corrected. I have the integrity, honesty, and courage to say that we're not perfect and we're not even the best in all things.

If you insist against all evidence on louding the superiority of whatever country you happened to be born in no matter what, you're a dog, a sycophant: and in the USA, that's the opposite of a patriot.

@MDN:

Apple has no control over how the mobile phone providers charge their customers. That is apparent from the widely different plans in just European countries.

Apple had to change it's pricing model to receiving subsidy payments for the iPhone because it couldn't get a cut of the monthly service charges from companies in many countries outside the U.S. Apple's only recourse is to pressure the mobile phone providers, or pull the iPhone.

Most likely Apple has a contract in place to provide a minimum number of iPhones to Rogers, but no requirement to sell the iPhone in Apple's Canadian retail stores. Thus the move – Apple can penalize Rogers by cutting back on shipments and refusing to help Rogers by not selling the iPhone through Apple Retail Stores.

Oh, and the paperwork is absolutely HeIIish.