MacDailyNews - Where Mac news comes first

I am glad that is cleared up. I guess I won't be cleaning my iPod Nano with the same steel wool that I used on my 4th generation iPod. Darn.

Good to see a response from Apple at this stage clarifying the issue.

"'If customers are concerned about scratching we suggest they use one of the many iPod nano cases to protect their iPod.'"

-- they aren't selling the cases yet..(still 2-4 weeks i think)

The only problem I see with the response is the mention of using a protective case with the Nano... since the cases were not available when the product was shipped. People will harp on this incessantly.

It is nice to see Apple respond, however.

I, myself, have experienced minimal scratching from daily use since I received my unit. Standard unprotected iPod "wear & tear", which I expected.

Bring on the complainers.

opps... its 4-6 weeks still

I scratched mine but it was all my fault. You see I had on my diamond wedding ring and was fishing around in my hubby's pocket looking for the biggie and scratched the mini. Darn shame too, the biggie is self-repairing.

I can't believe people haven't worked out what's going on. It's because the black model is by far more popular than the white one, and the black glossy finish shows scratches much more than the white one.

Go into an Apple Store and look at the two side by side - all the store models are pretty scratched - and the black units look much worse. As black nano salers overwhelmingly outnumber white units, and apart from the U2 ipod there's never been a been a black iPod, the higher visibility of the scratches on black has never been a matter for complaint before. Now that they're in circulation in massive numbers, people think that they scratch easier simply because the scratches are more immediately obvious.

Stop whining, get a case. Or better still, do what I did and buy this:

http://www.theinvisibleshield.com

Its fantastic! Renders the iPod scratch-free with an invisible coating.

My third generation 40GB iPod's face can be (and has been) easily scratched if I don't watch it when around hard, pointy things.

However, I now use a high quality paste silver polish on the entire exterior of the case at least once a week, and now it looks ALMOST like new!

I bet bucky at flawedmusicplayer.com is going to patting his own back on this one. (I like the idea of someone raising awareness on issues, but he was way too proud of himself.)

1/10 of 1% sounds very low. In quality manufacturing terms, its 1000 parts per million. This is, seriously, an unacceptable defect rate.

6-sigma quality programs go for 3.4 defects per million.

I hope Apple isn't passing off "1/10 of 1%" as acceptable.

"they aren't selling the cases yet..(still 2-4 weeks i think)"

"opps... its 4-6 weeks still"

There are already about a dozen third party vendor products... It doesn't have to say Apple on it... Remember, Apple doesn't actually make these things... They just design and market them.

Oh wait, never mind my last comment. I was being an idiot. Obviously Apple WASN'T passing 1/10% off as acceptable. If it were, it wouldn't have issued a statement to address the issue, promised to replace defective units, and explained that it's a vendor issue.

Do the test yourself

Go to an Apple store and compare the demo models - the iPod that has been there for a couple of months being handled daily by the public shows considerable less scratches than the Nano.



MDN word = "deal" as in deal with it Apple.

I don't think he is saying that 1/10th of 1 percent is not a problem. He is just trying to clarify that it is a manufacturing problem and not a design problem. This reassures shareholders that Apple's design is okay and does not need to be changed which would be a recall of all the devices sold.

This should mean that people will be able to get it replaced and that the manufacturer will be held responsible for the issue that caused the cracked screens.

Yep, I did the test. Went into my local Apple store with a Brillo pad. Took one iPod Photo and one iPod nano, and scratched the hell out of both of them. Scientific-like. Sure enough, they're both a mess.

Then I shoved a red hot poker up my nose, to sort of illustrate another point, the particulars of which I seem to have forgotten in the searing agony that ensued.

"I hope Apple isn't passing off "1/10 of 1%" as acceptable."

Did you miss "Contact AppleCare and the iPod will be replaced, Dalrymple reports."???

That clearly shows they aren't passing it off as acceptable... They are acknowledging the problem and will replace it if it cracks...

Everyone seems tot forget how modern manufacturing works... Apple uses other companies, under contract, to make their products. This is SOP for an ever growing percentage of of companies these days...

"Go to an Apple store and compare the demo models - the iPod that has been there for a couple of months being handled daily by the public shows considerable less scratches than the Nano."

Good point Marcie, except that I have been in Apple stores numerous times over the last 6 months, and have never seen as much activity around the larger iPod as I have the iPod nano... It is simply getting a ton more attention, and thus tons more handling... more handling, more scratches...

The out of control thread over at Apple discussions is now locked. It hit 704 posts.

"Then I shoved a red hot poker up my nose, to sort of illustrate another point, the particulars of which I seem to have forgotten in the searing agony that ensued."

Nose? Damn... I shoved the red hot poker up the wrong end... now I can't sit down!

I think it's because the nano is such a masterpiece that people want it scratch free. The other iPods scratch as much, but nano has become a design object

SteveJack was right. All of the iPod nano screen scratchers either never owned an iPod before or work for Creative, Microsoft, and/or Napster.

Case closed. (pun intended)

MW = "within" - keep your iPod nano "within" a case and shut yer yaps.

I am impressed with how fast Apple has responded to this issue, usually it would take a lot longer for them to admit any type of issue. Considering how critical it is that the product not be perceived as having issues, it was in their best interest. It also shows how fast people are to jump on Apple...the problem with being number one is you always have a target on your back.

As far as scratches, I think my 20GB iPod scratched way too easily period...so I don't think the Nano is any different. As long as the stores have cases (which they didn't at launch) I think it is 100% necessary to get one. Then you have no issues. Either that or get plastic polish, the same they use on the rear windows of convertable car tops. Does the job very well.

This is obviously another Rovian trick issued from the bowels of the vast right-wing conspiracy.

Jeez, don't you guys follow the news ?

They closed the thread at 704 posts because they were being bombarded by dubious posts from new users with zero previous posts. When you say something obviously ignorant like "I only placed it in my pocket ONCE and it looks like it's been raked over with a nail file" you know they aren't telling the truth.

While the screens are the same between the iPod nano and the iPod, it may have something to do with where people keep their nanos.

If I stick an unprotected iPod in my pants pocket, it would probably be "screen up" (ie, the screen would be at the top of the pocket) and the screen would, therefore, be safely away from my keys, change, and anything else I might have in my pocket.

The iPod nano, on the other hand, probably goes "screen down" into a pocket because the audio jack is on the bottom. This puts the screen right down there with my keys and spare change and adds to the potential for scratches.

So, yes, the screen is just as prone to scratches as an iPod, as Phil Schiller said. It's just that because of the placement of the headphone jack at the top of the iPod, there's less possibility that the screen will be exposed to junk. In other words, while I'd certainly agree that the people with scratched screens should know better, Apple shares at least part of the blame by designing the device so that the most delicate part ends up exposed to the most abuse.

Generally, I expect Apple to be smarter about things like this. It's the sort of goof I'd expect to see from Creative...

I visited an Apple Store last week and checked out the Nanos. I'd heard of the scratch issue, so I looked for it. None of the floor models had noticeable scratches. So I took my fingernail to a black one to see how easily it scratched. It didn't scratch. While this isn't the same as weeks of use, it certainly doesn't seem like the "soft plastic that's easily scratched" as some people have implied.

And by the way, I love the Nano. The new software is elegant, as well as the software it inherits from iPod photo. Flipping through photos was blindingly fast. If I didn't already have 2 iPods, I would have bought it on the spot, but out of fiscal responsibility, I'm waiting for the next generation.

We the Apple fans have super high tolerance on the inferior side of its creations. Of course, it starts off from our equally super high expectation level. So, once we see the minor scratches being formed, we put skins and tubes (many shops in HK already carry them) on our lovely baby.

I think this is called LOVE, we love our iPod.

But then, MDN, many readers who have their nano scratched (more seriously than others) have no sin. Don't suppress their griefing feeling ok?

Ah HA! So it was a QC problem. I mean, after reading that Torture test, it doesn't really make sense that it's a design flaw. Because obviously not every nano has the broken screen problem.

Is it possible that the Nano has will scratch more in a pocket due to its size and weight? A full size iPod, due to its size and weight, stays put in my pocket more so then the small lightweight Nano. More movement equals more potential for scratches. Just an idea.

Why doesn't the isue with 100% of the single 1.8G5 power mac's being defective get any press. Apple's been BS'ing us for months with no fix.

Notice this model wasn't out for long.

This is where after two hours of uptime, you are guaranteed to have a Quicktime web page or switching to full screen crash due to a faulty SMU.

This, my friends, is why I've kept my nano in its plastic all this time. And I'm not taking it out till the cases start showing up.

We have not heard the end to this scratch issue. Mine has been in an iPod Sock from day one and carried in my shirt pocket yet it has hundreds of small scratches while the back is scratch free. By the way what are the many covers available, I have seen only the arm band available.

Good job Apple and shame on those and MDN for rubbishing those who've got cracked screens. This was the real issue not bloody scratches (see my previous posts). MDN, you should remember what an editor use to say "Never let the truth get in the way of a good story".

Cheers also to Matthew Petersen for highlighting the problem as well.

Gosh this could lead to a new fad, pre washed jeans and now pre scratched Macs. Oh wait, I got that with the cube and you know what, it doesn't bother me.

Hope those cases show up.

Oh please, Matthew Petersen has been an asshat and is just trying to milk his 15 minutes, that's all. 1/10th of 1% isn't what I'd define as a widespread problem. As for the other 99.9% of us, we're simply enjoying our nanos and wondering why so many people are screaming over a problem that only impacts 0.1% of the nano owners out there. If you happen to be one of the unlucky ones, you get it replaced for free anyway, so STFU and be happy.

It really goes to show you the power of the internet. You can make a mountain out of a molehill in no time. An issue that effects a microscopic segment of iPod nano buyers (1/10th of 1 percent) has been blown so far out of proportion so fast, that it makes it seem like they're all defective.

So I guess from now on when 4 people post online that they have a defective Sony TV that every single one should be recalled then? Or how about we do that with computers and DVD players and everything else too while we're at it? Before long there wouldn't be anything left to buy because everything would be recalled! Geez, what a stupid f*cking joke this whole thing is. Some people seriously need to get a little thing called a life...

Apple made an announcement and now my scratch problem has magically disappeared!

Anyway, I had the original ipod, an ipod mini 4gig (two of them because the first was defective) and a 6 gig ipod mini. I bought the 6gig the day they were available and up until 2 weeks ago it had no noticeable scratches. i haven't used a case for any of my ipods and the minor scratches that they had didn't bother me.

As i stated before, after less than one week of use of the nano, the "time remaining" section of my screen was no longer legible. the brasso fix worked, but i still see this as a problem. i will buy a case as soon as they are available at the apple store. i just don't understand the animosity i see on this board. why is it OK for apple to create a product that requires a third party case to be usable? it wouldn't be ok for any other company? my cellphone is 2 yrs old and i can read that screen just fine. no noticeable scratches. i'm used to macfanatics expecting MORE out of apple than other companies, not less.......

...and blaming a defect on the consumer..... lame...

"...and blaming a defect on the consumer..... lame..."

Seeing as how the typical consumer is pretty much an ignorant moron (as evidenced by many of the posts you see here on this massively overblown topic), I wouldn't really blame them if they did to be quite honest.

I think it makes sense to try and protect an iPod ... they are not disposable items ... the problem with this issue is that you have no way of knowing how a given person has treated their iPod ... some people are very careful and some are definitely not ... even though they will claim they are ... just look at rental DVD's to see how 'careful' the public is.

"I hope Apple isn't passing off "1/10 of 1%" as acceptable."

LOL as if that is the true number! Any other company's estimate would be met with extreme skepticism, especially here.

minor issues that can affect Apple's long standing and continuing
lead in the "digital music" realm. By rectifying the situation quickly
they have shown that it is important to address customer concerns and
dampen the media's impact on thier newest iPod.

Believe it or not...some people are REALLY investing some serious
cash on the iPod nano and expect to get what they pay for...don't we
all???


CT =====]------------ Going for broke

Yup, my recent 4G iPod 20GB scratched horribly in the first few days of ownership, and I took effort to protect it!

My wife was appalled at the scratches, and wanted me to bust it and return it.

The Brasso fix saved me, she wondered how it was back to new. Brasso and a cotton tshirt.

MW = "audience", as in all of you.

You guys are sheep at Apple's fence. Doesn't that ever get boring?

The defective screens have been acknowledged -- that's the second time in recent history that a defect has been acknowledged *fairly* early in the run, and a remedy offered. This is a promising new turn of attitude for Apple.

The screens are scratching. A lot more than the previous devices. Maybe it's to do with the way people are using them which differs from the way they use the larger units (I like the post above regarding the upside-down pocket placement due to the headphone on the bottom.) If you get scratches that are unsightly after a lengthy period of use/ownership, i can see "for long term preservation, use a case" as an answer. But if normal use for less than a month results in a screen so scratched as to hinder use of the thing (as my friends have shown me), that's a design problem. Whether it's the material or the user experience, it's a design flaw and should also be remedied.

1/10th of 1 percent ... let's see how many that MIGHT be ...

Last quarter ... 6.5 million iPods sold = approx 72,000 / day

Nano on sale for 20 days ... estimate 50% of iPods sold = 36,000 / day times 20 = 720,000 sold so far

1/10th of 1 percent = 720 units with broken screens (we are not talking about scratch complaints here) ... I'd say it is likely close to accurate ... although we will never know for sure

"I think it makes sense to try and protect an iPod ... they are not disposable items ... the problem with this issue is that you have no way of knowing how a given person has treated their iPod ... some people are very careful and some are definitely not ... even though they will claim they are ... just look at rental DVD's to see how 'careful' the public is."


Derrick you're absolutely right. Myself, I take extra care with my iPod. I have a 20GB iPod photo and for the first day, I set it aside until I got a proper case for it which covers the iPod completely and it's been in the case since then. But even so, I don't just through it in my bag. I'd carefully place it in a position which I know nothing will ever come in contact with it and I make sure my keys or anything hard is no where near it. And of course, my iPod does not have a scratch on it. Now, I consider that being extra careful. But I doubt many people are as careful as I am.

My dad however is terrible with his stuff. he has dropped his cell phone so many times that yes, the screen on his phone has scratched. so has the screen on his PDA. But according to him, he's taken care of his stuff.

God you people never give up. Apple admits to a problem, I change my website to acknowledge the problem is solved and yet you still find the need to attack me. Sounds to me like you need to get over yourselves. If I was doing this for 15 minutes you would all know at least what I look like by now wouldn't you say? I probably pass you people on the street and you have no clue. How is that for famous? And yes I do give myself at least some credit for this. Had it not been for my efforts people would still be wondering what to do with their broken Nano. The reason other Apple issues don't get these results is because they didn't get the publicity. I never went to the media, the media came to me, and the reason was that the iPod is a hot topic. If I had had a complaint about anything else I doubt it would have been resolved this quickly. I am just glad Apple is going to replace everyone's broken screens and not just mine. So either start matthewpetersonisamegalomanic.com or shut the hell up about me and what I was trying to do.

“The defective screens have been acknowledged -- that's the second time in recent history that a defect has been acknowledged *fairly* early in the run”

as opposed to... having mass hysteria 3 years after a product is launched.. *ahem

vendor meaning.. apple does not and never has manufactured these screens.. they buy them from someone else (kinda like the iPod battery..)

"The screens are scratching. A lot more than the previous devices. Maybe it's to do with the way people are using them which differs from the way they use the larger units (I like the post above regarding the upside-down pocket placement due to the headphone on the bottom.) If you get scratches that are unsightly after a lengthy period of use/ownership, i can see "for long term preservation, use a case" as an answer."

well, it's the same material as the 4g iPod.. but it's probably just the black ones that are smudging.. makes sense, one of the downfalls of having a black, shiny surface (psp....psp...psp....)

there is NO remedy for 'it's black and shiny'

and Apple is replacing broken screens..

great.. business as usual then?

Good to hear the screen cracks were an isolated thing. And as long as the materials are the same as previous iPods I guess people don't have much room to complain about the scratches. They better get the cases out pronto though. In the meantime, I think the people at invisible shield have got to be loving this. I know that I will recommend them to anyone getting a nano and will get one for me if I can ever talk the wife into letting me get a nano (which I don't really need, but really really want )

Here is a good review I saw on the invisible shield. This one looks like a winner.

http://www.rainydaymagazine.com/RDM2005/GearNGadgets/September2005/RDMGG_InvisibleShieldFirstLook.htm

A few defective displays were shipped to customers and Apple must
have an effective accountancy of the situation which helped them to
quickly respond with an answer the customer wanted to hear.

How this shit happens is beyond me, but clearly...there was no harm
done (other than needlessly disturbing the customer sercive dept).


CT ======]------------ Not too too serious

Kudos to Matthew Peterson for changing his website to reflect the new situation. I don't know if I would have gone about it in exactly the same way but this has certainly vindicated his position.

Also I would like to apologize to Matthew for taking him to task so hard before. Being a major fan of a company that, even though it has superior products, was in serious trouble and perhaps danger of extinction not too long ago can inspire a fierce defense sometimes.

(However, I still think it was weird that your response on your website said you watched the video but didn't see Steve pulling the nano out of a pocket.)

According to Gizmodo, the invisible shield is a product from 3M called "ScotchCal"