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Nov 23, 07 - 07:02 pm Comment from: Mac4lfe

I saw this change firsthand at The Gardens Mall Apple store in Florida. At first I was a little confused looking for the registers but then someone stepped up and offered to ring me up right int the spot. This was very convenient.

Well done Apple.

They've been doing that restaurants -- even small ones -- in the EU for years. I had always wondered why no one did it here.

Nov 23, 07 - 07:30 pm Comment from: Jim - TIV

I was at the mission viejo store today.... Holy Cow Batman.

Nov 23, 07 - 07:58 pm Comment from: echo416

i was at the SoHo store 2 weeks ago buying an iPhone for my wife and they still had cash registers and had to line up to buy an iPhone that were kept behind the cash registers. Although long, the lines did move quite quickly.

A cash register is a pretty dumb computer for a computer company to use, for chrissakes.

DOH!!!

I meant the lights on the cash registers!

I wonder if Laura Goldman knows David Goldstein????????

Nov 23, 07 - 08:29 pm Comment from: pastrychef

What happens if you want to pay in cash?

Nov 23, 07 - 08:34 pm Comment from: Vlad

"What happens if you want to pay in cash?"

Cash is Unamerican. Real patriots use credit cards so the government can track you at all times. Untraceable cash helps terrorists. So remember, if you use cash, the terrorists win!

Nov 23, 07 - 08:49 pm Comment from: James

Seriously though-what does happen if you want to use cash? Does anybody know?

Nov 23, 07 - 08:50 pm Comment from: ron

Cash??? Get 4 dividend credit cards, which each pay $300.00 per year, change them every three months, so that at the end of the year you have $1200 in dividends. You must pay all bills every month. I have never paid interest on any card, so I don't care what the interest rate is. Just do it.

Nov 23, 07 - 09:02 pm Comment from: James

Come on now, of course I have cards-I am just genuinely curious whether or not cash can be used at the Apple store.

Nov 23, 07 - 09:02 pm Comment from: qka

What store(s) did that author visit? My local Apple Store - Eastview Mall, Rochester, NY - has HALVED their Genius Bar with their recent remodel. So much for his claim that the GB's are getting bigger!

They still take cash. They have a till under the counter so you don't notice it.

Nov 23, 07 - 09:29 pm Comment from: The Other Steve

I bought a pair of iPhone earbuds two days ago in Crystal Court in CA and did the same thing, "excuse me, where do I pay for this?"
She wiped out handheld PDA cash register thingy (how long before that becomes an Apple product?) took my credit card, and said my receipt was just emailed to me. I LOVE having my receipt on email so I can look it up anytime I want.

The strange thing is, I was in the middle of the store and didn't get a paper receipt. When I walked out, how did they know I paid for it?

Nov 23, 07 - 09:44 pm Comment from: Vlad

"When I walked out, how did they know I paid for it?"

They all have cyborg implants in their eyes that allow them to see which customers have paid as digital representations. When they whip out the hand-held scanner it actually does a complete holographic scan of your body and inputs your DNA structure into their computer system. The computer then adds digital annotations to each customer as to whether they have been helped, what they have bought in the past or whether they are a new customer, whether they have paid for their current purchase, and so on.

Also, there are holographic scanners on the exits that will automatically detect if you are leaving with unpaid merchandise, no matter where you hide it.

Nov 23, 07 - 10:56 pm Comment from: TowerTone

or it could be a deactivated RFID.....

Nov 23, 07 - 11:06 pm Comment from: The Other Steve

@TowerTone

Na, I like Vlad's answer better.

Of course, the best part is that the operating system used by the scanners comes from Microsoft. I think it's Windows CE.

C'mon, Apple! Build a credit-card reader for the iPod touch and use that!

Nov 24, 07 - 12:06 am Comment from: ken1w

They've been doing the "scan your credit card with handheld device to pay" thing for years and years. If this is considered "news" by the popular media, Apple really is ahead of it's time.

The "personal trainer" (and "concierge") are pretty new. Good ideas that put Apple above the competition.

did i miss something here...mdn's link is titled with david goldstein....but when i click on the link, i get a Business Week article the doesn't have david goldstein in it...and it is by cliff edwards...

I guess i missed it somewhere....

help me

Nov 24, 07 - 01:10 am Comment from: shen

"Of course, the best part is that the operating system used by the scanners comes from Microsoft. I think it's Windows CE."

tis true.

they are also the slowest machines in the store, and the only ones i have ever seen crash.

pretty funny.

Sorry to disagree with people, but I find the new stores without cash registers to be very confusing and a source of frustration for customers. Apple Store employees are actually usually busy helping people (that's a good thing normally). If you go into a store knowing what you want and stand there (where?) waiting for someone to help you or looking for an employee who isn't busy... Lots of Luck! In practice, it's just not working (and make it even more complicated for everyone involved and try paying with cash). This is an example of change that brings no improvement to the process...

I agree with Dave! A cash register just plain works. Keep the PDA'a with every employee but have a register too.

Nov 24, 07 - 02:09 am Comment from: ambidextrous

macgravy,
Read the article. Here is a quote:

Rather than unveil a Velveeta Mac, Jobs thinks he can do a better job than experienced retailers at moving the beluga. Problem is, the numbers don't add up. Given the decision to set up shop in high-rent districts in Manhattan, Boston, Chicago, and Jobs's hometown of Palo Alto, Calif., the leases for Apple's stores could cost $1.2 million a year each, says David A. Goldstein, president of researcher Channel Marketing Corp. Since PC retailing gross margins are normally 10% or less, Apple would have to sell $12 million a year per store to pay for the space. Gateway does about $8 million annually at each of its Country Stores. Then there's the cost of construction, hiring experienced staff. "I give them two years before they're turning out the lights on a very painful and expensive mistake," says Goldstein.

This guy is the PRESIDENT of research? I hope for his companies sake he doesn't work there any more. I believe this link takes you to his company:
http://www.cmcus.com
Sure would be nice to see what his opinion of Apple Retail is now.

Nov 24, 07 - 04:17 am Comment from: MaLvado

Too bad those portable scanners use Windows =(

Nov 24, 07 - 07:36 am Comment from: Macaday

Seems to me there is a case for both an obvious paypoint AND roving checkout staff...

Either way, it doesn't seem to be stopping Apple stores from selling like others only dream of doing.

OK then... how much of the stores' success is down to the stores' layout/atmosphere/location etc and how much due to people being driven there by the products/advertising/word of mouth?

One can't do without the other I guess. Apple have the two working beautifully in tandem. Exactly the way they have the software and the hardware in tandem too.

What a company. What products. What designers. What a leader. What a recipe for success! Go Apple!

Nov 24, 07 - 09:23 am Comment from: silverhawk

The store pay point hasn't changed, although it does move around now. I was at Southdale Edina last night. I asked were the Touch was and he brought out one, then iWork 08 and some other things I needed. He put all the info into his little red gizmo. He asked for my card and I said I'd be paying cash. He led me to the old check out area and scanned everything using a iMac, took my money, gave me the receipt and I was on my way. Oh, the iPod Touch is much nicer than I thought! Well worth it if you have less than 2000 or so songs.

CASH is KING!

Wasn't there also a story some months ago about the same aspect of Apple Stores, and how it was potentially unsafe as they are transmitting data on their Wi-Fi network - which is open and not encrypted in any way?

Anyone know if that is still the case, or does the data get transmitted in a different way other than the store Wi-Fi hot spot?

@Peter, I agree. Lame to be using Windows CE. How hard would a doc connector card reader be to make for the iPhone/iPod Touch, I mean really!?!

It was a painful and expensive mistake.

The Mac Pro cost me thousands. I dropped it on my foot, and I should have gone to the store in Clarendon, 'cause it's closer.

Nov 24, 07 - 01:45 pm Comment from: NCIceman

Apple stores truly are an experience. Even though they are often packed with customers, help is usually just a step away with a friendly inquiry, nothing pushy. Ringing up is an equally simple process. Once again Apple takes their philosophy applying it to something as mundane as retail and makes it a winner.

Nov 24, 07 - 03:15 pm Comment from: Hg Wells

I agree with Dave. Portable checkouts are really good, but there must be a fallback place to go. And even though emailed receipts are really good, you must be able to get a printed receipt on the spot at the store. And Apple had better not stop taking cash. I hope we don't see a trend developing on the no-cash front and I don't want that to be one of Apple's "innovations." No cash for iPhones? (The reason is inconsequential.) What's next? No floppy drives in Macs?


(Now, don't forget to uncheck, "Notify me...".)

I used to work at a store. And yes, "Windows CE powered" is printed on the back of the mini scanner devices. They used to use iMacs w/Java based POS software, but it's like they're saying "Macs can't run our own retail business."
The video surveillance computer in the back was a Dell.
Quite disappointing and hard to believe that there couldn't be a Mac based solution for all these things.

Do you suppose they went with the Windows and Dell solution because it was cheaper than using Macs? Also if it crashes they can't blame it on OS X?

I don't know what Apple is using for it's POS system but a good one to use is Xsilva Lightspeed. http://www.xsilva.com/ It runs on Macs and only Macs and it's amazing. I've used it when working at an Apple only reseller. We took cash too but we didn't have a cash drawer under each cashiers spot at the desk. It worked just fine for us. ... I think the PDA on every employee is stupid. I think there should be cashiers at actual registers with cash drawers but that's just me. That's my two cents.

Nov 24, 07 - 10:45 pm Comment from: zmarc

They've been using the portable scanners for years at my local Apple Store and it's great.

Emailed receipts are *optional* (they can print you one if you want, but it takes extra time and wastes paper).

They do take cash (but not for iPhones).

Nov 24, 07 - 11:48 pm Comment from: Hg Wells

Big Mac!, Lightspeed may be good, but for smaller retailers, it seems expensive especially since you have to pay a lot for a service and support agreement. Admittedly, I have not done some comparison shopping, but, at first glance, it still seems high to me.


[Now, uncheck "Notify me..."]

Hi all: What brand are the "PDA-things" that Apple Store employees are using. This could be a clue to future Apple products...

I don't know why the CE and Dell stuff for those purposes. My guess is all of the former Gap people in the upper echelon of the retail division and the go with vendors you know thing. Actually a little research revealed that 360 Commerce that supplied apple with the POS software was bought by Oracle which now pushes the mobile palm and CE based POS. Since Steve and Larry are old pals, that's the reason I'm sure.
I don't remember a specific "brand" on the devices, but they looked like palm pilots from 10 years ago with a card swiper attached to the bottom. And as far as the crashing, the devices themselves were slow to log into, and would show wildly different battery life all the time and then stop in the middle of transactions. I avoided those things like the plague. Hopefully they're better now, but my experience using them would make me avoid them if I were buying there.

Yeah, a deal with Larry could be explained, still it's like running PC ads with a Mac in the photo, only in reverse. I'd think that they would want to use the Mac/Apple technology exclusively.

As a small business owner it would impress me a lot more that they could truly meet all of my needs. I don't want Parallels or a "PC" solution on something that I'm paying more for initially. ROI is great, until it goes downhill when I need to spend an additional $300.00 - $700.00 per machine to install another OS and use those programs to do what I purchased the Mac's for. Not to mention the hassle of running two OSes at the same time. That require more processor and additional RAM. Instead of competing with those who are already making Apple third party software, they should be filling the gap with software that doesn't exist for the Mac.

Sorry, didn't mean to single you out. I'm just frustrated at the shortcomings of the Mac and Apple's software. I spend a lot of time trying to track down "Mac" solutions. Quite often settling on less features and paying more than the PC alternative(s).

I don't like this change at all. I went to the Apple store in the U. Village in Seattle to get a replacement for my stolen iPhone. All I wanted to do was walk in, buy it and leave.

The place was packed and I couldn't find a register. I asked the Apple associate standing by the door where can I buy an iPhone, and he held up his handheld scanner and said "Just look for someone with one of these!" as if he was too busy to sell me a $400 product with the register he was holding.

The register people are wearing the aqua colored tshirts and two of them are standing behind the Genius Bar with about 15 people crowded around. One is chatting with a customer and not ringing anything up. Another is checking out a man with a towering pile of boxes. That leaves one Aqua-shirt left that can sell me an iPhone.

The one available associate is talking to a man not buying anything, but he needs help on something. And there are two other guys converging on her at the same time I am. When I get my "turn", I tell her that there are two other guys who want to check out and leave which seems to have caught her by surprise. She was gracious and pleasant even though I was stressed out because I felt like I was skipping ahead of the other guys.

I should not be reduced to being a stalker so I can spend money! I should never have been pushed off on another associate who is obviously too busy. Why didn't door guy GET me a checkout or do it himself? Such a botched experiment in customer service is not what I expect from Apple.

The idea of no cash registers is nice, but it hasn't been implemented well. Its extremely problematic during times when a store has heavy traffic. And if I had known that buying a $400 product would be so stressful, I would have gone elsewhere.

@ Hg Wells - "Big Mac!, Lightspeed may be good, but for smaller retailers, it seems expensive especially since you have to pay a lot for a service and support agreement."

Yes Lightspeed does seem expensive but I believe Apple can afford it. I wouldn't exactly call them a small retailer given how many retail stores they have and how much money they're making these days. Again I've used Lightspeed and find it quite amazing for a POS system. I personally think it would suit Apple quite well. I've never been to an Apple Store seeing as there is none here in Calgary Alberta or my home town Ottawa Ontario so I can't say from personal experience if it would actually work but I can see it working just fine.

yep I agree with you montex! At least you have an Apple store to go to. They are getting closer now, only a two hour drive for me.

I love the handheld armed employees always works out great for me.

montex, if your local Apple store is always packed just call and make a appointment first. Then someone will meet you at the door "probably what the employee that handed you off was doing" and give you one on one service.

I work at that U Village store, and for the most part I think our easy-pay handheld systems work great, there are a lot less lines and overall people seem happy without the cash registers. The fact that we only have one POS register does get people confused though, but I think once the whole system has been in place for a while and people begin knowing what to expect before entering the store there will be less confusion. I apologize you had a less than satisfactory experience montex, the reason the door greeter wasn't able to check you out immediately is that his job is to welcome people to the store and send them to the right place, and if he were to leave his post then people would be entering the store unnoticed, something we try our best not to do. Usually if you leave your name with the greeter, they will radio ahead to someone free who will meet you halfway and get you helped, but unfortunately if the store is really busy, like anywhere, you may have to wait a few minutes. Also, something to keep in mind is that almost all the employees are carrying the easy-pays, not just the blue-shirted concierges. I hope your next visit is easier and swifter, and I encourage you to fill out the survey linked on your receipt, as all input made there goes directly to the store and is most definitely taken in to account when modifying our floor-plans and the overall way we conduct business.

I agree that there should be a mac solution to this situation. When they first implemented those things, they said, "Don't leave it sitting anywhere because of 1) someone picking it up to use it while you're logged in, and 2) It's proprietary technology."
That made me laugh hard because a car wash near my house had been using that type of system for a good 2 years before that. They tried to make it seem like it had been invented for use in the Apple stores. They'll say it's for the customer, but really it's so people on the floor can sell as much stuff as possible.

Nov 26, 07 - 10:19 am Comment from: shiftOpt k

"I give them two years before they're turning out the lights on a very painful and expensive mistake."

Apple is not gateway.

i tried to use cash last week to buy an iphone

they don't accept cash for iphones, so i used a cc (seems they still have the 2 iphones per person limit)

i then had to get back in queue to buy the accessories i wanted with the cash