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Devices like this are not for geeks. Apple knows its primary audience is not geeks, just consumers who want items to work as advertised. Ubergeeks do make a lot of noise, though.

"impressed all those who touched it"

And at least one woman who licked it. Oh, Olivia. . . I'll be in my bunk.

Jadis
you SOOOOO got it covered. I agree. Geeks are the noisiest on the net and blog-o-sphere but make up a very small part of the market. The best thing Jobs can do is not listen to ubergeeks and let them play with their UMPC's.
There's a big consumer market out there that avoids technology because of the horrors microsoft put them through.

We know what a hit those are...were.........will be?

Simplicity is key, especially for typical consumers.

How many VCR LEDs flashing - 00:00 - have we all seen? How many people could actually program and use VCRs, computers and digital cameras beyond a few basic functions.

Being able to use MS Word and play Solitaire on a PC is not being techno-savvy!

The fact that I see little need and no desire for an TV must mean that I'm a geek. I guess I'm content plugging my PowerBook in to my HDTV, using an upsampling DVD player and ripping music onto my iPod with Apple Lossless....

Still, iTunes needs to offer a flat rate subscription service for TV and movie content before this thing really soars.

I agree with drz, flat rate monthly subscription service for unlimited tv show rental. Then maybe single movie rentals. And then, but won't happen, flat rate unlimited movie rental al a netflix.

I won't mention who posted a 'blog entry under the banner:

Apple TV = hacked

OK, it was O'Grady. But ... don't go read it. The "hacking" referred to was to the hardware, not the software. It was local, not remote. It was about as interesting as adding memory.

It's a cut-rate, re-purposed Mac mini ... and that isn't a half-bad thing to be.

Gotta love Ars Technica's articles - super geeky and super thorough.

I touched the AppleTV...

...it didn't like me for some reason.

This is what I don't get about the whole "Aw, it sucks because it's not a DVR and a DVD player and shit!" argument.

"Well, er, let's see... Would you pay a couple 'a hundred more dollars for that functionality to be added into one unified package?"
"Well, sure!"
"Okay, this is a Mac mini..."

And Vóila!!! An AppleTV with DVR and DVD reading, plus...
Web surfing...
Email...
Adobe Photoshop® Lightroom™...
GLTron...
etc...

With clever marketing, this is a slam dunk. The mini could use a bit of a boost in specs at the 500 dollar price point, but it in the perfect position to claim the premium-end media interface slot.

-c

MW: 'girl' (you betchyer sweet ass)

Please buy more stock at higher prices

So the big question for me is.

When will iTunes copy DVDs that you own into iTunes just like it copies songs from your CDs that you own into iTunes?

Seems only natural.

hahaha, "I'll be in my bunk." Thank you, Twisted, for knowing that.

I'm just glad to see a few sane reviews starting to come out. I'm not a technogeek and I am let down by the TV as it offers nothing over what I have now with my Airport Express ... because ... no 5.1 .. and for those outside the USA, there's no iTunes video content available which even more severely limits its desireability.

I waited a long time for this device, not for one moment thinking Apple would cripple it so badly. Now I'll have to wait longer or buy something else.

The TV will gain functionality with time. The whole scenario feels like something is off. I bet that HD videos were supposed to be available on iTunes, but weren't negotiated in time. I'd bet that the powers that be are trying to knock Apple down a peg or two. Hopefully, no one else will emerge as a legitimate competitor, so Apple can move ahead on its plans. It's a certainty that Apple intends this product to do more. It's a matter of when, now.

MDN "husband" as in I'll be in my bunk, too.

Good article.

I wish good luck to TV, but this convinced me even more that I want a Mini as soon as it goes Core2 and .11n, and an HDMI out would be nice, but I don't see Apple shootong themselves in the foot with that, so DVI-HDMI and Toslink it will be.

One gig of RAM in the cheapest model will be more than adequate for my living room. Front Row handles all I want.

Maybe they will change the Mini's name to TV Pro...

MW:cost, as in getting what you really want cost less than what you save when you don't..?

TT, you just proved the whole point of the article. I mean I can wade through the geek that you just spoke, but I'm getting increasingly tired of Having to, you know?

Brau;

Co to read roughly Drafted's latest on the AppleTV, it DOES do 5.1, read it:

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q1.07/147048D8-D8B7-45E7-9A97-3CD5B4C2B75A.html

MW= bill, as there's no bill for that service!

"Maybe they will change the Mini's name to TV Pro..."


How about the Mac Maxi? With an enhanced and absorbent control pad.

TMF-
Does that mean it could stick to the wall? That would make it red hot!!

Busting-I'm probably missing something.

You just need to touch it to be impressed?

WOW...impressive (and no, i'm not touching anything, with the exception of the keyboard, at the moment)


Yes Tower Tone, it could stick to the wall, well....if you got some chewing gum, that is (Attention: neurones could stick to the wall as well, use with caution)

@rahrens,

Very interesting and insightful article. I really want to post the parts that clearly demonstrate how MS bastardized the mpeg4 codec, especially in light of the perception that everything Apple does with online media is "proprietary", when in fact, and I've said this all along, Apple is often either setting the standard, or conforming to real media industry standards. as opposed to contrived industry standards like V3, VC-1, and even WAV, which essentially became a standard simply because there were so many Windows installations on the planet, not because it offered anything better than AIFF was already offering. Its incredible how many people perceive AIFF as being an Apple exclusive, incompressed audio format and of couse nothing could be farther from the truth. AIFF has been the true universal industry standard for uncompressed digital audio since the beginning of audio CDs going on thirty years ago. I still wish that MS would get off of the WAV crap and simply conform to the already established AIFF - which DOES NOT stand for Apple Interchange File Format - dammit.

I did not agree with the article's implication that the average user would not hear the difference between Dolby Pro Logic Surround, and Dolby 5.1. For any media that was orginally produced with 5+1 audio post production, and given a room where a listener could quickly A/B betweent the two, the average listener would instantly pick up the difference assuming that they were listening to a part of the program or movie that was actually utilizing more than two channels at that moment. This fact does not imply one is simply better than the other, only that there is a difference.

The author also was a little ambiguous on how Dolby Pro Logic should actually be setup to actually take full advantage of what it has to offer. Pro Logic is basically a free-space matrix developed by this formula: (L+R)+(L-R)=surround matrix. While its true that there is only one physical connection (one pair of wires) for the surround content in Pro Logic, the way that surround channel is distributed is what actually gives you a sense of "immersion" when listening. In a true Dolby Pro Logic decoder, that single surround channel actually shows up as two speaker connections on the back: One speaker is wired with the positive and negative leads in phase with the front speakers, and the other surround speaker connection is meant to have it's leads wired with positive and negative reversed, or out of phase with the front speakers. It is only in this configuration that Pro Logic Surround sound can be fully realized. One thing I like about Dolby Pro Logic Surround sound is that audio production that is only available in stereo can take on a surround sound like quality by allowing the listener to hear out of phase audio material more discreetly, where a simple stereo playback of the same material would tend to mask out the more out of phase audio.

With my DVD player I don't even have to think about it, I just hook up all of the 5.1 outputs to my amplifier with corresponding speakers, and the DVD player takes care of the rest. If it senses a movie with Pro Logic surround then it automatically reverses the phase of the Right Rear Channel thus automatically rewiring my system to take full advantage of what Dolby Pro Logic has to offer. Most if not all DVD players with discreet 5.1 analog (RCA) outputs offer this convenience, I'm not sure about DTS.

MW="toward": As in - Toward a better understanding of how MS continues to screw the consumer.

If they add numerous extra features in, then people complain that they want this capability but hate to pay for that capability which they would never use or it is not flexible enough). If you don't add extra features in, people complain that it is useless because they do not want to buy it plus extra components.

Sigh....you cannot win for losing.

@ Mr. Peabody

Great post, as always.

We so often forget an obvious fact.
Bill Gates is a geek. For the most part people don't like geeks.
Steve Jobs is not a geek. Bill will never understand Steve.

Steve knows what my 83 year old mom wants in a computer, and in a tv. And if she ever got the idea that she wanted to take the pictures and stuff on her computer and look at them on her tv - Steve would know how to give her that. Indeed he has!

Geeks don't understand that, or my mom.

One more thing Steve knows. Even at 83 years of age there are more of my mom and her like out there than there are geeks.

Hence - the TV will sell.

Word.

MW: 'thirty' (million)

"For the most part people don't like geeks."

Maybe over rice or noodles with a nice Chianti.


MW: members (only jacket - not steel metal)

Apple TV is nice, but I messed with one at the NYC flagship store and the video quality on the SONY TV was horrible. I had a non-geek friend with me (I was the geek excited to see the Apple TV in action) and her first response was that the picture was bad. Apple needs to get a higher quality file available for purchase on iTunes. And I know Steve Jobs is dead set against it, but it's time for a movie rental option. That would be worth buying an Apple TV. I could get rid of my blockbuster account. And couple that with a DVR... game over. Apple TV is a nice start, but it's got a way to go. I'll wait. iPhone first please.

@ Freddy the Pig: "We so often forget an obvious fact. Bill Gates is a geek. For the most part people don't like geeks. Steve Jobs is not a geek. Bill will never understand Steve.

Steve knows what my 83 year old mom wants in a computer, and in a tv. And if she ever got the idea that she wanted to take the pictures and stuff on her computer and look at them on her tv - Steve would know how to give her that. Indeed he has!

Geeks don't understand that, or my mom.

One more thing Steve knows. Even at 83 years of age there are more of my mom and her like out there than there are geeks."

Will your 83 yr old mother understand the difference between SDTV & HDTV. If not, she should probably avoid the TV because to set it up she'll need to know the difference. Will your 83 yr old mom know whether she should pick 480i, 480p, 720p, etc ... because there's a bunch of those settings on TV too. Will mom understand & accept why SOME of the video she has saved on her Mac in Apple's own QT format (lets assume she anticipated the importance of this before TV arrived and saved all those home movies in QT in the first place), and which work fine on her Mac, won't work on TV? Will your 83 yr old mom remember to have her computer turned on before using TV? Will your mom - obviously having some life-experience with the Depression Era - understand the logic behind paying $15 for a movie that doesn't look as good as the $8 Walmart DVD she has on her shelf? When you tell her she can buy TV shows at more reasonable prices off the iTunesStore, do you think she might ask why can't she just watch them on cable, since she's already paying for that anyway? Or from the antenna for free? And if you tell her "But you'll always have a copy if you buy it from iTS", do you think she might respond, "But I can always use the VCR for that, silly goose"? Do you think your sweet old mom might also wonder why a 3 decade old piece of technology - that trusty VCR - can do something as basic as recording a TV show for free, and the brand spanking new TV can't?

Look, some of us who are complaining are doing so with the non-geek in mind, believe it or not. In fact, most geeks are like most Macolytes (if for different reasons) - they love the whole idea of this box just b/c they now have something they can putz around with. It takes more than an attractive interface to make something a slam dunk for the average person. Using the product also shouldn't require more thought than what the ads saying 'TV will play the video on your computer' imply. And a successful product for the average person should also do what the average person has come to expect from the OLD devices they already have, or some of the newer devices that some of their friends might already have (like Tivo).

How does that not make sense?

"... the TV will sell."

You're right. It will sell like hotcakes. To Apple geeks.

@Odyssey67
And the thing that just grabs you by the nuts is that there are more and more and more and more Apple geeks out there every day.