MacDailyNews - Where Mac news comes first

" People who are set on getting that black MacBook are going to have to wrestle with the US$150 artificial mark-up."

What is artificial about the price of a product in demand? It's called supply and demand. It's called capitalism. Why should Apple be any different than any other company and not profit from a product that is in demand.

If someone wants to complain about artificial markups, why don't we start with something that really impacts people's lives, like the artificial markup of oil and gas.

I agree with macromancer -- all mark-ups are artificial or no mark-ups are artificial. Businesses need profits -- let the markets decide.

You don't know about the history of artificial markups.
I don't either.

$150 for a color change is quite unreasonable.

$99 for a leather iPod case when better one's online can be had for $25 is unreasonable.

$30 for six iPod nano covers?

Don't get me started on that overpriced, over marketed iPod HiFi.

I'm very rich and can buy any Apple device I want, but I'm not a fool to ignore value.

If I start buying too high then it makes it harder for others who are struggling to buy. So I buy cheap with value or else the basterds will charge whatever they can get.

The rich have a obligation to keep prices down for everyone else.

a rich company is a lazy company

Well, it's sort of artificial because the supply of white plastic and the supply of black plastic are both very large. If Apple so chose, they could make 90% of the Macbooks black for the same production price.

One could argue though that it's difficult to predict demand for the black version of the Macbook, but that as purchasing patterns become more clear Apple will adjust production and bring the prices closer together.

Yeah - More oil means more use, which means higher prices, and higher and higher and higher.

Even with capitalism in full tow, shouldn't it cost less when there's more of something and more people are buying more of it? Why? Because you'll make more money, 'cause more people will buy 'cause the price keeps dropping on a product that is more and more in demand.

With oil, I think its the most ridiculous practice, that we raise prices when we want to, or need to, make more income for oil. Come on we're in America - If you lower gas prices, make no mistake, Americans will drive A LOT more, and you can go to the bank on that. As it is, I think Americans should stop driving for just one week, see how the oil market likes that; but no...

I still believe that, if Apple can get its market share up above 10% or 15%, or more, we will begin to see an across the board price shift - downward. Any smart business person who wants to make a lot of money, and significantly shift market share in their favor, knows the game is knowing when to start lowering prices to snowball the momentum your product has.

"a rich company is a lazy company"

And Microsoft the lazyist company on the planet???

everyone knows black plastic is more expensive to manufacture than white plastic.
that´s why the black nano costs more than the white nano.

oh, it doesn´t? sorry.

Just picked up a black one for my wife yesterday to replace her 3 year old 12" PowerBook. If we follow the same replacement cycle, the extra $150 works out to $50 per year. Plus most of mine and my wife's clothes are mostly black, so the MacBook matches most of our wardrobe. Yeah, yeah, any justification I can come up with. Just call me a fashion slave, fan boy and lemming. Make my kool-aid a triple shot venti with extra foam.

She does NOT want to install boot camp on her MacBook, so I've still got to keep my lone Windows laptop. Now we have 4 Macs and 1 Windows PC, a big turnaround from 4 Windows PCs, 1 Linux machine and no Macs.

The Black mark-up just gives Apple a bad reputation and fuels the Windows belief that Mac's are more expensive for no good reason.

If you want to make the top of the line laptops black only so people will pay extra just to have the black one? Cool!
But don't make people feel stupid because they want a black one.

OK, so here we are:

MacBook Pro: A noisy griddle.

MacBook: A variety of noises to accompany the spinning beach ball when doing anything graphic.

Apple's answer to these problems: there are no problems.

New iPod: none.

Result: Stock tanks, the Mac faithful line up for more because Macs are better than PCs. No, not as good as they could be or as good as they should be, but we keep buying Steve's disappointing crap anyhow.

What fools we are.

Stealth Marketing 101: I didn't realize you needed to be "very rich" in order to buy any Apple device you want -- a little extra cash will cover that. But thanks for being such a conscientious shopper -- thereby helping keep the prices down for the rest of us. Man -- if you just went out and bought stuff -- well, probably the rest of us couldn't afford to buy anything at all.

No stocks, no money Sam: Cost of plastic is irrelevant. It's free enterprise -- let the markets decide. Prices will always adjust appropriately in a free market. If Apple can make a higher margin on some products -- more power to them. Buy the white one if the black one doesn't warrant the price differential for you. Others may be willing to pay more for a black one -- that's their choice. Again, let the markets decide.

Give black MacBook owners something for their extra money! Include iWork and one year of dot-mac.

Apple can still do that with an after purchase online rebate similar to Aperture except iWork and dod-mac wont cost Apple as much AND will help to expand market share for the two products.

Am I the only one for whom 2006 minus 2001 equals 5, not "almost seven"?

Big Week for Apple: One of the stupidest comments I've seen posted here. As if the stock "tanked" for the reason(s) you're suggesting.

You are correct on one point though -- what a fool you are!

Frankly if they're gonna offer colored MacBook cases for an additional $150 then they should also offer red, orange, yellow, green, aqua, blue, purple, retro-beige, and pink. If FastMac can get $70 for the Mini cases then Apple should be able to get $150 for a rainbow selection of MacBook cases. Side effect of this is that the price of the black cases would no longer seem so "artificial".

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea.

Include a year of dot-mac and show new mac owners one of the best advantages of using a mac. (not to mention how well it works with iPhoto, iWeb, address book, iCal, iMovie, and the now built in iSync.)

"What is artificial about the price of a product in demand? It's called supply and demand. It's called capitalism. Why should Apple be any different than any other company and not profit from a product that is in demand."

I LOVE APPLE BUT HOW IS THIS DIFFERENT FROM THE MUSIC LABELS ASKING TO SELL SONGS FOR MORE THAN .99? WE ALL REMEMBER HOW STEVE ACCUSSED THE LABELS FOR BEING GREEDY!!! EVEN IF APPLE CAN GET MORE FROM CONSUMERS FOR BLACK MAC BOOKS ISN'T THIS GREEDY AS WELL?

"If you lower gas prices, make no mistake, Americans will drive A LOT more, and you can go to the bank on that."
That is presicely the reason that I like the high gas prices. I don't want people to drive more - this country needs to get it's act together and start forcing car manufacturers to make cars that get decent gas mileage. The technology is there, but there is no incentive to make them until the price of gas is outrageously high.

But, back to Apple, they probably could lower the price on all of their computers. Right now, there is very large demand and Apple wants to grow slowly - too fast and it causes problems. So, to keep the demand low and generate more income per computer, they are selling them higher. As the initial demand starts to drop off, probably later this year, expect the prices to drop back to what they were with the PowerPC chips and early next year lower than that.

Apple wants growth, but not too fast, so they will get cheaper over time, but don't expect any Dell-type prices. See what is happening to them - they aren't making nearly as much money on the low end computers.

I like Apple, but $150 for a black MacBook is a total ripoff. Its a shame how there are so many blind apologists on this board.

Interesting that Ars all but says that the MacBook has the same temperature problems as the MacBook Pro, probably due to the same misapplication of thermal paste.

Apple needs to get this right ASAP.

As MDN said if you don't want to pay the extra $150 then buy the white one and your problem is solved.

John,
That's what I thought as well. People that keep saying "let the market decide" need to heed their own advice and stop complaining about other companies as well.

my post above was referring to the post by "John" about the music labels.

"Buy a white one and paint it black."
- paraphrasing the Rolling Stones

Apple should consult all those complaining about $150 markup and ask you how much profit is ok on all their products. That's a great strategy!

If you don't like it just don't buy it. Get a white one and use it in the dark...

THINK PEOPLE...
If something is too expensive for YOU, then don't buy it. Value is relative and for some people having a black MacBook is easily worth $150.

I don't have Cable/Satellite TV at our house. Why? It's not worth it to me. However, there are millions that think it is. Who is right?

Re: Oil Prices...Supply/Demand only works in an elastic market. Oil Demand is relatively inelastic. BTW, most of the oil is used for industrial purposes not motor fuel; think Plastics.

Re: Rich Guys Buying "Value"...Historically, rich guys have been the first adapter of new technologies (eg. cell phones, microwave ovens, DVDs) Thier inital purchase, at a very high cost, enabled production to increase and prices for the masses to come down. It is imperative that the rich buy the latest and greatest in order for the poor to eventually have it.

the other Mark: Great point about the "rich guys" need to be the early adaptors so the rest can eventually have it.

Stealth Marketing 101: Take note "very rich guy." As if!

The black MacBooks are matte, not glossy... sheesh, get it right, reviewers!

It is imperative that the rich buy the latest and greatest in order for the poor to eventually have it.

sure the rich can take a chance on new technology, but paying $99 for a leather iPod case when a better one can be had for $25 is something totally different.

If the rich avoid paying the absurd prices for ordinary items, then the prices come down to something more realistic that most can afford.

Apple is ripping people for the iPod HiFi, the leather case and the iPod nano tubes. And they are ripping people who choose the black MacBook over the white one.

So the black MacBook is $150 more for just a color change. Big deal.

If it was clad in aluminum and called MacBook Pro it would be $600 more.

At only $150 more it's a bargain.

I won't buy the black for $150 more.

Listen "Big Week for Apple"

When you take a look at the garbage that PC hardware companies create in comparison with what Apple creates, it's takes a fool NOT realize the how far superior Apple is!

I noticed people complaining about the keys spacing on the keyboard. The key spacing is the same, at least the actual tips where you type. The MB keys just don't dip down inbetween the key tips like a standard keyboard. But the gap distance is still the same. There is an optical illusion though that makes the keys appear to be spaced further apart.

I tried out the keyboard, it feels the same to me as any other and is a huge improvement over the old iBook keyboards.

Does not the price difference for the black MacBook also include a hard drive that's 20GB larger? Why, then, all this insistence that the higher price is related only to the color?

I just received my white Macbook w/superdrive. Popped two 512's in it. Folks, this is one incredible machine. It is so much thinner than the pictures look. Attention to detail is why I buy Apple.

Does anyone know if Motion will install on this Macbook with 64 megs video ram?? That is my only concern. I don't care if it runs realtime...I just want it to install and work.

WOW is the word from everyone here at work. I am gleaming. Front Row is impressive.
Careful when installing RAM. It is easy, but hard to figure out at first. I thought I pushed the RAM sticks in fully, but after a failed powerup, I went back and push really hard and felt them go in farther and everything worked fine. Scary, though.

Evidently Econ 101 is not taught in high school anymore.

A few have mentioned supply and demand so you pass. S&D;is how the free markets work and how companies like Apple make money. They make a laptop because people demand it. They make black laptops because people demand it. They charge for those items because that is why they are in business.

Is it a rip off that all Apple has to do is put their logo on a piece of merchandise made in Taiwan to get premium dollar? Is there value in having an Apple logo on the back of your laptop lid?

I guess some people have not heard of "limited editions". Forever companies have put special badging or colors on products from computers to SUVs and charged more for them even though they differ little from their mainstream cousins. Is it a rip-off if Ford charges more for their Eddie Bauer edition SUV than the standard model just because it is green and tan and has the words "Eddie Bauer" on the side?

A black MacBook is simply a limited edition model which is produced in lower quantities in order to make it more valuable. Just like diamonds (of which there are gajillions), limiting the amount in circulation makes them more valuable.

On this same note, this is true of oil as well. The most efficient source of energy on the planet, one of the most versatile substances on the planet, and one of the most abundant substances on the planet, oil maintains a high price because its supply is kept in check. Ironically, our government does just as much to limit the supply of oil (and thereby increase its cost) as OPEC and other cartels do. Don;t complain about oil prices if you are one of those NIMBYs who don't want to drill for it on our soil or under our oceans.

We have more oil available to us than we need in this country under own own feet but being the environmental imperialists that we are, we prefer that other countries drill for our oil so that we can keep the tundra pristine. Of course, if it were not for liberal policies that keep oil prices artificially (a true use of the term) high, we would be less concerned about the middle east.

Did y'all read this review? It's got RIGHT CLICK!! One-handed right-click! How did this slip by without anyone noticing!?

"Am I the only one for whom 2006 minus 2001 equals 5, not "almost seven"?"

The writer is refering to the iBook name which was released September 21, 1999.

s.

A word to the clueless - if you don't like the prices, don't buy the product.

You don't have to buy a MacBook (in black or white). You don't have to buy $99 leather iPod cases. You don't have to buy overpriced RAM from Apple, either.

As soon as folks stop buying so many of these lesser-value products, Apple will change prices accordingly.

A fool and his money will soon be parted...

People, whether you like it or not, Apple can set its prices for its products. That's its right as a maker of the product. That's the free market. We don't have to buy it, but we can if we think that the price is acceptible. That's the free market. Note the two terms here: free and market. Free as in freedom and in lack of force, market as in a place where you buy and sell things.

The $150 price difference is not just color, as another poster pointed out. You get a larger hard drive as well. Now you may feel that these two things ain't worth it. That's totally fine!

I myself don't find the value proposition worth it, either. However, I do expect to pick up the black one (used, natch) when Apple releases round two of the MacBook.

If I want to pay extra to get a black one, that's my business. If you don't want to pay extra, buy the white and buzz off. Don't be pissed off at the people who choose the black one and pay extra. Don't be pissed off at Apple for selling it for more. I lease my computers and if I can get one a little cooler for an extra $3/month, what's the big deal? If I could sell something for more by changing the color, I would. It's a free country. Get a life!

People pay extra for color all the time. Two Tone paint on your new truck will cost extra, metalic paint will cost extra, getting mono paint on your vehicle where even the door handles are painted will cost extra, what's the big deal?!

"As MDN said if you don't want to pay the extra $150 then buy the white one and your problem is solved."

"A word to the clueless - if you don't like the prices, don't buy the product.

S&D;, Capitalism, Don't buy it, blah, blah, fucking blah. BULLSHIT! The black MacBook is price gouging plain and simple. The extra cost is 100% TOTAL FUCKING BULLSHIT. There is no reasonable explanation anyone can give to defend it - ESPECIALLY THE "DON'T BUY IT" EXCUSE. FNA! I love Apple products just as much as the next person, but my objectivity will not be thrown out the window just because it's an Apple product.

Parody of a bumper sticker:
Dear Steve: Please Save Me from Your Followers.

The 150.00 is only for the color since you can get a white one with an 80gig HD for 1349.00 and the black one is 1499.00. That's why people are complaining about the color.

Some car manufacturers charge Hundreds, if not Thousands, of dollars more for certain colors.

What's the problem?

Ok, it is black and it cost more?!

Just throwing this out and see what happens.

If I had to guess, the priority would be to produce white Macbooks and then black-since the standard color is white. Now, if you wanted to slow the purchase of the black unit based on number of units in stock then you would create a price difference? Right?

The way I look at it is-they made fewer black ones and a lot of white ones.

Supply and demand? Perhaps or maybe I am just shooting at Osama!

So does everyone here saying it is great for Apple to charge more for the black MacBookI have a question…

Does everyone here saying it is great for Apple to charge more for the black MacBook because they can or because demand allows etc., also think it is okay for Sony or any of the other labels to charge Apple more than .99 for songs that are popular or that the market would allow?

I saw an awful lot of you same people complaining about the “price gouging” that the record labels wanted for songs “just” because they are popular etc. I don’t see a difference here. Capitalism is capitalism. If you can charge more and make more profit on something in demand, what difference does it make if you’re talking about songs or computers?

Jerry T,

It is capitalism. The one generating the revenue has all the power and gets to set the prices. That would be Apple in both of the cases that you mention.

Ordered a white 1.83 Macbook 2 days ago! Can't wait!

It will never run boot camp either!

Fred Mertz,

I disagree that capitalism is the one generating the revenue getting to control the price. I think that capitalism is driven by the ones doing the buying.

You can “set” the price of anything to what ever you want. But if the price is wrong and consumers don’t buy then you don’t sell. So consumers ultimately “control” the price. Try selling your old broken NOKIA cell phone on ebay for 5 or 6 six times what it would cost brand new and see who controls the price.

My question wasn’t though, what is or isn’t capitalism. It was about people saying that Apple has every right to charge more for a color that is in high demand. Which I think that they do. But many of those exact same people being up in arms that music labels could even consider charging more for music that is in high demand, i.e. popular new releases etc.

It was rhetorical…

Who else thinks MacWorld magazines should review hardware as thoroughly as Ars???