MacDailyNews - Where Mac news comes first

"Vista, I'm glad I missed ya"

May 13, 08 - 11:23 am Comment from: Think

How many more companies are now NOT going to buy Visa?

How Apple is reacting to the situation? Seriously what is Apple doing to benefit from the Vista mess?

sigh...

'Wow'...

just, 'Wow'...

Vista... what a bunch of crap...

Glad you could manage to get in some domestic-bashing along with the usual MS hatred. Okay, we get it, you don't like MS and you believe that OS X is the solution for every computing need.

GM has made huge strides in the last few years in delivering products that are actually selling without huge incentives. Much of their marketshare they've lost has been profit-damaging fleet sales.

Go drive a new Malibu, Enclave, CTS, G8, or Aura. You'll be surprised that they're not quite your father's rental car anymore. And this is coming from someone that's always driven German cars.

How appropriate, Microsoft & GM together. I wonder what the Soviet Government & GDR are planning to do about Vista?

May 13, 08 - 11:37 am Comment from: Jay-Z

The 7 years between XP and Vista was already an eternity in the technology realm. I'm amazed that people will actually continue using it. It baffles my mind. Keep yourself chained to Microsoft for all I care. You're only hurting yourself.

I spent the last 10 years working at car dealerships, putting pictures and info on various websites. This meant getting in the vehicles, moving them around and being very familiar with what almost every make and model had to offer. To my eyes, GM is pretty weak. I doubt switching to Macs would do much to fix that...

CTO?
Bring back the GTO!

May 13, 08 - 11:41 am Comment from: Think

If only they could sell a combo pack, Vista and a free neutering for the idiot that bought it.

Then just wait 30 years for a lot less PC jerks.

It's great to see Microsoft finally subject to their own F.U.D. campaign. According to Mr. Bill, Windows 7 is right around the corner (2009) and who doubts that it will be much, much better than VISTA.

Yea, that's right Mr/Ms Businessperson, hold off on that purchase of VISTA and, at the same time, please hold your breath for a fast, elegant, modern OS from M$.

May 13, 08 - 11:43 am Comment from: Cubert

I'm always dismayed by Winblows users who say XP is good enough and they don't mind sticking with it for a decade! They can't even see the things they are missing out on.

May 13, 08 - 11:44 am Comment from: shen

"Killeen figures GM could install Windows 7 in three or four years"

lmao! it has to come out first! good luck!

"GM has made huge strides in the last few years in delivering products that are actually selling without huge incentives. Much of their marketshare they've lost has been profit-damaging fleet sales."

yeah! like their great hybrid program!

oh.... wait.....

look, if GM made even one good model, i would care about your opinion. they don't. they make giant gas guzzling crap and tiny underpowered crap. the fact that i can buy a car that gets better gas milage than their tiny junk cars and yet be roomier, more comfortable, and out accelerate their v64 giant "canyonero! 2 lanes wide, seats 35!" tells you everything you need to know about that useless company.

dear god even ford, home of the "we look back to our past, when we mattered" attitude has managed to get a hybrid to market.

....oh sure, they did it by buying toyotas "last year" tech, but hey, every good company needs a microsoft to their apple....

For GM, holding off on Vista also means saving money (and therefore achieve a better bottom line) by not having to upgrade their computers.

I just bought my first Toyota after mostly GM's.

May 13, 08 - 11:46 am Comment from: KingMel

I hate the plastic faux-chrome. And it is being used on more expensive cars, too. A friend of mine bought an H2 a few years ago and I was amazed at the quantity of plastic trim on this "off road" vehicle - even the grill was plastic.

As far as OS's go, Apple's early releases of MacOS X had a lot of rough edges. Although consumers have been fairly ready to upgrade to the latest release of MacOS X, it is not clear to me that companies will move as quickly. Apple will have to be careful to minimize bugs and compatibility issues and facilitate OS transitions as it gains corporate market share, or it will face similar criticisms as M$.

May 13, 08 - 11:47 am Comment from: LateRegistrant

Microsoft Windows
Your rut. Our revenue.

The next version of Windows, if it ever actually materializes, would be another attempt to deliver a software product that works adequately on hardware built by others.

Apple's next cat will extend an already robust and proven system.

May 13, 08 - 11:48 am Comment from: Macromancer

Mac+

Are you serious? Have you not been watching the news for the last couple years? How about listen to an Apple conference call?

Mac share is on the rise. They aren't going to go from 5% to 50% overnight. In fact, Apple never had more than 15% market share at their peak. To get back to 15% would be HUGE. They will do it, and when they do, it will be HUGE.

May 13, 08 - 11:50 am Comment from: Basil Ganglia

I agree with Mac+. Apple is doing virtually nothing to woo enterprise customers in the wake of the Vista mess. This is a huge mistake in my opinion. Essentially they are depending on prostelytizing Apple-fan employees to make their pitch. That's fine but there needs to be backup from Apple (sales teams, large scale purchase discounts, implementation teams to retrain employees, help with migration of proprietary software, etc.). Apple offers hand holding and one-on-one teaching for new Mac consumers at its Apple Stores. Why not the same for enterprise consumers?

".. going straight to Windows 7"

That sounds like hopefulness personified.

What on earth makes them think that in another 4 years Microsoft can create anything better than Vista - which took 5 years?!?!

Sad sad sad.

The first time GM produced a compact Front-Wheel Drive car, called the X-Platform, the V-6 models had to have the engine mounts dropped partially out to change the oil. I'm not kidding.

General Malfunction spent enough money chasing it's tail during the tenure of Roger Smith to have bought Toyota, Ford and Nissan combined at their then market value. GM has nothing to show for the money. Today, Toyota alone is worth more than the entire US car business.

General Malfunction and Microsoftopoly deserve each other.

May 13, 08 - 12:03 pm Comment from: ron

Ted, " Much of their marketshare they've lost has been profit-damaging fleet sales."

No Ted, their market share has dropped because they have to charge a couple of grand extra for each car they sell because they're stifled by union contracts and retiree pensions that they thought they could afford when they had the market to themselves.

And where do they go when Window 7 turns out to be worst then Vista.

May 13, 08 - 12:12 pm Comment from: HazMatt

I drive a 2003 Subaru WRX and my wife drives a 2004 Chevy Malibu. I like my car better for a lot of reasons, but the Malibu gets better gas mileage and still has plenty of power. It's bigger and more comfortable too.

So, what I'm saying is that my IMPRESSION is that domestic car companies like GM, Ford and Dodge are currently just as good as foreign cards.

I'd also like to point out that when MDN (and others) whine about this company or that company sticking with Windows XP they just sound like babies who, through tear-stained eyes, crying out "Just get a MAAAAC!! WHY won't you just get a MAAAAACCC?!?!?!". Gawl, just grow up people. Mac vs. PC isn't that big of a deal.

May 13, 08 - 12:24 pm Comment from: Timbo

Well, MDN does wear the Mac World Conquest pin loudly and proudly, no doubt about it. If that gets under your skin, do what others do - go read elsewhere for a while, and when you are feeling rowdy again come back to MDN!

As for GM, Vista and Windows 7, I echo what others have said. The companies that say they will wait for MS to get it right with Windows 7 are making a VERY strong assumption that it will be markedly better than the standard fare of Windows junk. Our IT dept won't touch Vista with a 10-foot stick. We, the Mac Minority here, are a fortunate bunch, to be sure.

Can MacDailyNews name a single automaker that uses Apple computers?

May 13, 08 - 12:28 pm Comment from: iamdj

IT'S FARGIN' WAR! ~ Ballmer

GM Stories writes, "The first time GM produced a compact Front-Wheel Drive car, called the X-Platform, the V-6 models had to have the engine mounts dropped partially out to change the oil. I'm not kidding."

That's news to me. I had such a car - the 1980 Buick Skylark. I'd customized it with V-6, stick shift, buckets, sport suspension and wheels. It wasn't a bad car. But GM makes nothing available in the US that interests me now.

May 13, 08 - 12:37 pm Comment from: Buster

I bought GM most of my life but now I am finding that the stupidest things go on them...dashboard lights, blah blah. I have bought my second Japanese car and it justs runs with no problems.
Gm IS like MS and their cars (some anyway so don't flame me) are like Vista....when it just has to be...good enough!

Ted,

These are latte liberals we're talking about here. The same ones who think a muslim one-term Senator will rescue the nation with trillion dollar socialist programs.

They don't keep up on the industry, all they need to know is the message among their circle of friends which says that Toyota and Honda are the only good cars you can buy. They're not aware of great new product coming out of GM like the 2008 Chevy Malibu, 2008 Cadillac CTS (with the V-Series model slated for next year recently scoring the best lap time on The Ring for a sedan), and 2008 Saturn Aura. They're in the dark about the 150mpg Chevy Volt plug-in hybrid currently undergoing testing with new and stable lithium-ion batteries that will change the face of cars as we know them. The car that's currently on pace to beat a much weaker plug-in Prius to production.

It will take years before the reality of the new GM catches up with the perceptions of the Birkenstock crowd.

May 13, 08 - 12:41 pm Comment from: Harvey

If these companies are waiting four years for the next version of Windows, that gives them four years to think about their IT policies. It also gives Apple four years to impress them with their professionalism and quality.

An all-out push for the enterprise right now would give very little return for the expenditure. Building confidence one product at a time based on quality and quiet professionalism is a much wiser approach, because it looks a lot more professional and is much more productive in the long run than Ballmer's technique of lurching around screaming pie-in-the-sky marketing plans from the rooftops.

Apple never pre-announces its products or its marketing plans, because that would tip off the competition. Silence from Cupertino doesn't meant they're sleeping, it means they're scheming.

May 13, 08 - 12:41 pm Comment from: silverwarloc

@Thomas:

Therein lies the problem. Besides, I don't think Apple will ever associate with these Ameican car companies. Remember what SJ said about creating junk. There's a threshold they won't cross.

Take Ford for example. They are in a product tie-in with their active-syc thingy in some of their cars. Now, think of the image it espouses when you juxtapose Ford and M$. I can only imagine what would happen when I'm driving and I get a BSOD.

"Mac vs. PC isn't that big of a deal."

It is if you own a large chunk of AAPL. You must not.

May 13, 08 - 12:42 pm Comment from: Harvey

The MacBook Air is really aimed at the enterprise. The iPhone will be too beginning in less than a month. The assault has already begun.

May 13, 08 - 12:42 pm Comment from: Toasty

We also will not adopt Vista.

May 13, 08 - 12:45 pm Comment from: Harvey

For those talking about cars: I have never owned anything but a Volkswagen. Not because of the car, but because of the country. I was a recipient of one of Germany's foreign aid programs when I was in high school, and it's my way of expressing my gratitude.

Well at least no one is doing Vista to Leopard comparsion articles anymore.

@Basil Ganglia and other market share zealots-

None of you people get it. Not only will Apple never make an effort to sell to the enterprise, they will NEVER slum out for market share.... EVER. Apple does NOT do business like PC companies do. You see where that has gotten them, don't you? When are you people going to get it through your thick skulls?

And why should they? They're highly profitable without going for market share. Besides, going for market share almost ruined Apple in the past. Apple is a consumer and professional company, NOT an enterprise company. That segment of the market is lame and is already dominated by the PC, and that'll NEVER change. Steve knows it and doesn't even try. And he's smart for it.

Apple is a highly profitable company, with a large stock price and no debt whatsoever. Why should they change their business strategy? Like their products, it "just works".

Jesus, you people really need to stop thinking like Apple should go the route of Dell, Gateway, etc.

May 13, 08 - 12:58 pm Comment from: HolyMackerel

For DRM reasons MS has moved most corporate users onto a server-based licensing model. Companies only have to ensure they have enough licences on this server to ensure everybody is current, saving them having to manage multiple client serial numbers. This has now tied many companies to XP and makes it harder for them to move on. The latest 'continuous reboot' on HP PCs must also affect many companies as HP are huge in the enterprise.

Damned if you do Vista, damned if you don't (XP SP3) - might as well go Mac. At least you can do work while XP reboots!

And to add on to my previous post-

Hasn't anyone seen the keynotes of the past, where Steve talks about Apple picking their key markets and strengths, and attacking those for all it's worth? That's what they've been doing for the past decade, and it has served them well. There's no need for them to channel-stuff or turn the clock back to 1990, when Sculley turned Apple into a bigger, yet less-profitable company that sold mostly to the enterprise and stuffed the channel to gain... YEP... MARKET SHARE. Within six years of doing that, Apple was almost dead.

Enough said. Apple knows what it's doing, and no amount of whining about them not making a cheapo box or lame-o business-class machine will convince them to change their model.

May 13, 08 - 01:05 pm Comment from: Harvey

My understanding is that the continuous reboot problem in XP SP3, except for a very few cases, is limited to machines with AMD CPUs. That says nothing about AMD and a lot about Microsoft's testing and quality control. Even if you have 100 XP machines that are Intel and you aren't affected by this problem, it doesn't exactly inspire a lot of confidence in Microsoft.

May 13, 08 - 01:26 pm Comment from: MrScrith

Notice something in the article "venders software", GM is probably using a lot of PC's in automation tasks and the automation software doesn't run on Vista, and probably doesn't run on any other OS, they are getting locked into XP.

LOL GM under the assumption that Windows gets smaller and faster with each iteration and so if they upgrade their hardware now they will be ready for the next bloated polished turd.

May 13, 08 - 01:29 pm Comment from: Buster

@R2... latte liberals... muslim one-term Senator... trillion dollar socialist programs...Birkenstock crowd.


Ha ha ha you are funny. The best part was the "They're not aware of great new product coming out of GM..."

You are a comedy genius....

Shen: Re: yeah! like their great hybrid program!

GM actually has a great hybrid program that is making actual fuel savings on vehicles that use the most fuel. The Chevy Tahoe Hybrid manages to make a huge improvement on fuel consumption, while still retaining towing ability and room for a large family. It also happens to have the same EPA City rating as a Camry 4cyl Sedan. In case you hadn't noticed, the American car-buying public is still fixated on SUVs.

May 13, 08 - 01:33 pm Comment from: Buster

@Asmodeus...I agree for the most part except that in my opinion, Apple will welcome enterprise IF enterprise comes to them on their terms. What that means is no cost-cutting, margin losing, wholesale selling of material to court enterprise.
If ya want it...ya gotta pay for it. Otherwise, there is a known alternative...sort of.

From seeing the likes of R2, it would appear the nutjobs are out and about today.

@Buster-

"latte liberals... muslim one-term Senator... trillion dollar socialist programs...Birkenstock crowd"

All labels used in an attempt to smear those who are sensitive to name-calling and don't tow the right-wing party line. There's no argument or rational debate found within the words of this person. Nothing but "I said it, now prove me wrong" tautology. It's pathetic and a good example of the groupthink, pseudo-mainstream mentality of the radical right-wing faction of the country.

Too bad tautology of this sort no longer works in this day and age of rad right minority...

@Asmodeus & Buster

You guys have it right.

The "enterprise" boosters just don't get it.

For the computer market, selling to enterprise is equivalent of "profit damaging fleet sales," as mentioned by Ted. It's a commodity market and like all commodity markets... low price rules.

And, as we all know, Apple just doesn't go that route.

@Buster again-

All great points,and I think Apple's recent history most likely proves you correct in your assumptions.

Thanks for your thoughts.

May 13, 08 - 02:38 pm Comment from: Basil Ganglia

@ Asmodeus & nobodi

I'm not talking about Apple mimicking Dell and other big box commodity computer sellers in the enterprise and I doubt if the others who argued for enterprise sales were either. That would be foolish. Apple needs to sell in the enterprise on their terms, which means high quality computers with good margins, making the argument that they bring ease of use, greater security, greater productivity, greater resale value, lower cost of OS licenses, and software updates that continue to run on older computers, which translates into longer hardware lifespan. I think these arguments could be persuasive with many companies, especially companies that use commuters as something other than dumb terminals, but they need to be buttressed by the kind of support in the enterprise that Apple affords consumers. That's not happening now. And, it doesn't have to cost a fortune.
While Apple shouldn't sacrifice its business model to compete in the commodity computer market, it is foolish to suggest that they shouldn't try to increase their market share on the terms above. That will only lead to greater profits, greater stock prices, more software in the games arena and potentially in some vertical markets where Macs are virtually absent (like architecture), and more influence in the computer community.