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What?! The Mac mini doesn't run bootcamp?

Someone understands. You get what you pay for.

It' not bad, but I bet I can get a dual-core Dell laptop for less than that with specs and portability that are just as good! (Better, frankly, since Windows is included standard on a Dell, and optional on the Macbook.)

I'm not trolling--I know Macs are good at some things, and ohh! Pretty! What I'm doing is price-shopping. If I'm going to spend nearly $1100 I want the maximum for my dollar.

heck yes. now if only I could unload my powerbook...

Will the Macbook run Aperture?

$1099 is cheap?:

Good luck finding a PC laptop with those specs. Don't forget the iSight camera, wifi, optical and anlog in/out and a way to run OSX.

S

To $1099 is cheap?
Have you thought of the long-term maximum for your dollar. The cost of your time and hassles, installation of Norton/Symantec. The time costs and worries of spyware, malware, and Windows Vist vaporware? The cost of what it would take to replace iLife, one step video conferencing, etc.? Tried Dell's customer service lately in India?
Have you considered you can run both OS's? Considered what Leopard will ship with? Lots to really think about. What is your total long-term investment?

I was just looking at the Dell website to see if certain "claims" could be verified. After much searching I found Dell computer with similar specifications to be more expensive. Since I am not the one making claims I will leave it to others to prove their point about Dell being so much cheaper. Finally, if you want a Dell please get one because I wish you luck with it. I must use a Dell machine at my job and I have only had to have it replaced 4 times in 2 1/2 years because of poor quality. So, if you can find a cheaper Dell go for it but be prepared for us to laugh at you when it falls apart in a few months.

Hey guys, noticed in this review it stated Maya benchmarks (though the link was to a book - duh) I was under the impression Maya didnt work under rosetta at all?!?! anyone clarify this ? ? i need an intel maya before i can upgrade

Me again. OK, I was wrong about the dual cores. The Dell didn't have that.

I'm with you on spyware and all that, it's just if Windows is cheaper, sometimes that's the bottom line. You can run both on a Mac but like I said, you have to pay for Windows if you want it on your Mac. The Dell just comes with it. Vista and Leopard aren't worth my planning for since they keep getting delayed anyway.

In this case the Dell is not cheaper, I found my mistake. Peace.

Article: "What's more, the 13-inch MacBook is only the second line of Macs capable of running both Mac OS X and WIndows XP natively (the first line being the MacBook Pro)."

MDN: "Apple Mac mini models are also powered by Intel and capable of running both Mac OS X and WIndows XP natively."


Don't forget the iMac with Intel inside. Mine runs Bootcamp flawlessly.

Michael

You guys, and MDN, are so NOT helping!

To the person saying $1,099 was over priced for what you get with the MacBook, I was able to put together this

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&oc=E1405S3&s=dhs

Dell Laptop with some (not all) of the specs of the MacBook and it cost $1,585. Maybe you should actually look stuff up before you talk out of your a$$. The one thing you do get with the Dell Laptop is an inch or so more screen room but you get so few of the other things that the MacBook offers. I can't see that being worth $500 more. Especially when you consider you can run both Windows and Mac OS X on the MacBook.

To price shopper:
Leopard has not been delayed. That would be Vista.
And oh what fun it will be when it is released... can't wait for the fallout!

price shopper states: "The Dell just comes with it. Vista and Leopard aren't worth my planning for since they keep getting delayed anyway."

Uh, last time I checked, 10.5 is still on schedule. Plus, you can find free copies of Windows all over the net (even the die-hard Microsoft fan boys won't pay for Windows).

And a standalone copy of 10.4 is actually cheaper than a standalone of Windows XP Pro (closest equivalent to 10.4).

To price shopper: buddy, you have it all wrong. First off, find a PC with same specs for $1099.

Second, Apple delaying? Smoked already? Apple is ahead of time by a full year: Mac with Intel were announced by end of 2007 and they are coming by end of 2006. Leopard is going to be released as a developers preview this August and will probably be out in November. Delay?

Mac OS X comes with every Mac and you CAN"T buy one for Dell: how about that. And considering the quality of Windows, what about asking for a refund for the pre-installed Windows and get the Dell with Linux. Having to pay for a pre-installed Windows on a PC is disregarding the value of well earned $s.

Price Shopper -

You mentioned that some people shop on price, as it appears to be your case - and if such, then the MacBook is cheaper for "close to like" Dell specs.

I know, Windows must be purchased, but do you not have a PC you will be replacing with this new computer? Can you not install that copy, or get a work copy to install on the MacBook?

Overall, price and resale value, the MacBook will win big time. Take a look at CraigsList or eBay and you'll quickly see how well the Toyota - er, Mac's hold their value vs. the GM and Fords, er - Dells of the world.

Lastly, Leopard is really going to be interesting. No one really knows what it will contain, but word is it will run XP and Vista applications natively (as Apple has legal rights to XP API's - and Vista's are the same).

And no - Leopard has not been delayed. The only timeline is late 2006-2007 and that has been all that has ever been said to that. Until something new is stated by Apple, they are on track.

Steve Jobs at MWSF:
"So people really liked Boot Camp, they liked it a lot. But the one problem we heard time and time again, was that you had to reboot the Mac every time you wanted to go from one Windows to OS X, or vice versa. And you know, it was then that it really hit us; people needed to run Windows applications, that was the real problem. People had to keep switching OS's to run the applications they wanted to run.

Why not let people use Windows applications they need, without having to have them buy a copy of Windows, install Boot Camp, and keep rebooting over and over again,into one OS from another...

So we thought about it, and thought about it some more, and came up with a solution, one we think is really fantastic, and it's so simple.

Why not just let people run Windows applications in Mac OS X? And today, I am here to tell you we did it.

Today, I am announcing that Mac OS X Leopard will run Windows applications natively in OS X, bla, bla, bla..."

Okay, so is this fantasy land?

Answer: No.

A reliable source claims Apple had acquired legal rights to Windows API in their five-year settlement some time back. During that five-year timeline, XP was launched, and Apple had legal right to the API's of XP.

But back then, what to do with them right?

Well now you know.
1. Move to a newer and faster Kernal which can handle this (Mach not the right flavor).
2. Build Windows API's into the OS allowing for native running XP(and Vista) applications.
3. Apple may build-in some slight speed hit, and Direct X games and such will not run, but 95% of what is out there will run just fine.

The result - Boot Camp with no rebooting and no Windows purchase necessary.

Oh and one more thing - no more Windows security conserns to deal with either ; )

Can anyone say OS X = value-a-hoy?

~Steven

SHUT THE

here's a link to comparison between the MacBook and a similar equipped Jello box.

click me

It's simple, you have the choice to get less features with a Jello box and you don't with a MacBook.

With a Jellobox you can get 'Doze for free vs you have to pay for it on a Mac.

So Mac's are still higher in price if you want to run 'Doze.

However if you want both Mac OS X and 'Doze, a MacTel is the cheaper option than owning two boxes.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but (legally) there is no way to run Doze on a Mac w/o buying a full-blown-non-upgrade version of XP. Dulls don't even ship with a Doze disc do they? Just a hidden partition or "reinstall" disc? So, there is no shorcut; you're looking at spending $90-$200 to run on a Mac.

I don't have an Intel Mac ( I have a G5 PM) and I have all Doze as "upgrades" back to 1984's(?) DOS 3.1, but I'd still have to buy an expensive new copy of Doze if I wanted to dual boot. I don't think so!

On the other hand, if Stephen is right it won't matter.

Steven, your scenario sounds great expect for one thing...

If Windows apps will run natively in Leopard, what incentive is there for developers to develop for OSX? Does this mean non-OS dependent applications from now on? I hope not, I want my Mac OSX applications where developers take advantage of what OSX has to offer. I want my applications to look like they were made for OSX?

shut up! if you're not in the market. have you tried to compare with the exactly the same PC notebook SPEC which macbook has? they're all much more expensive than macbook. Sony Vaio is way expensive, too. Dell? who's gonna buy this kind of crap? so PC can run both mac os x and windows XP (even vista)? NO. have you trie to run windows vista for both? for PC side, vista performance is terrible even you got 1GB RAM in there. design, quality, style no other PC notebook can compete with.

Leopard being delayed is a common mistake, Apple really never set an absolute date for release (unless I remember incorrectly, please correct me if I'm wrong), but when WWDC got arranged in August, the news spread like wildfire and so did the misfired rumors that Leopard would be released in August.

At WWDC 2005 Steve Jobs exact words were:

"Leopard will be out in late 2006 or early 2007."

The Quicktime broadcast is still viewable at apple.com.

Trevor -

"What incentive is there to then make Mac versions of SW when XP and Vista products can run under OS X? Won't developers just jump ship from OS X?"

Great question. Here are some answers, albeit lengthy.

1. Apple is not a group of cheeto-eatin' morons. Apple is going to cook in a speed hit to ensure that running Windows applications in Leopard is not blastedly fast.

How much of a speed hit is the big question?

OpenGL and other graphic cards goodies should run at nearly XP/Vista box native speeds (OpenGL games will run great, but DirectX need not apply), which could indeed kill off some Mac Game devs...

However, processor-instensive SW will see a speed hit, but here is the rub: Office, Quickbooks, etc... will take a "testing speed hit" but in real-world use they will run like they have since stone-based computing existed - just fine. Users in the real world won't "feel" the speed hit, thus in real-world use, there will be no productivity loss.

It is when Adobe comes into play that these benchmark speed tests make a marked difference. While scrolling a 300 page Word document may take 3% longer in Leopard than on a Windows box, a 400 MB PSD file taking 90 seconds longer to render on a Mac - that hurts - therefore this is not a viable solution.

Video is another area that cannot tollerate slight to moderate speed hits, which will incur if running Windows-based Pinnacle or AVID-like products in Leopard.

2. OS X interface. It will be clear to the user when they are running a Windows app. vs one that is native OS X. It simply won't "look good," and as we can see, looks matter.

3. Patterns & Decisions. If companies have not ported to OS X by now, they are not going to do so until Apple gains significant market share... Those already coding for OS X are either Mac-only SW vendors and will stay that way, or are in the Pro market and won't be able to simply "jump off" and say "Buy the Windows copy, it runs just as great and fast as our Mac version..." Nope, to risky, as it could push many AVID-like folk right off their SW platform and into the hands of the competition...

This could also push Adobe users to something Apple has behind curtain #2, or is it curtain #3? Which curtain was OS X for Intel hiding behind for five years?...

Thinking Apple isn't ready for this move is downright ridiculous. Adobe and others will be going nowhere.

Summary:

Basically, this is a "Get off our platform Redmond, we are not beholden to you any longer" move.

For non-demanding SW, they will run more than acceptably. Which SW vendors have these types of products that are not on the Mac platform already? Thousands, and it is those apps. will be ready to roll on Leopard.

~Steven

I have also heard that Leopard is going to bring virtualization abilities for any OS. Different than what Steven thinks and more in line with reality.

Steven, what is your source of info on the 'speed hit' stuff?

It isn't Steve Jobs and it isn't the kid down the street either.

Run with it. I like my job so that's what you get, understand?

~Steven

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