MacDailyNews - Where Mac news comes first

Apr 23, 09 - 04:31 pm Comment from: almux

Well knoe thing: DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!
M$ is doomed, period.

Apr 23, 09 - 04:32 pm Comment from: Asmodeus

To play Devil's Advocate, everyone is down this year. Even Apple.

Of course, Apple isn't down as much as the other PC companies. And the PC companies are helping to drag MS down.

I have mixed feelings. I hate to think that people will be losing their jobs...but then again, it is Microsoft!

Is that before or after paying the fines?

Woooooooot !!!

Can someone explain to me why Apple reports a profit, and their share price rises 3%, and Microsoft reports bad news and their shares rise 5% in aftermarket trading?

Apr 23, 09 - 04:40 pm Comment from: Arnold Ziffel

Kids, can you say 'beleagured?'

I knew that you could.

Apr 23, 09 - 04:41 pm Comment from: Admiral X

Whither beleaguered Microsoft now? -- 1997 flashback

Apr 23, 09 - 04:44 pm Comment from: Cubert

@Asmodeus,
My guess is that you are referring to Apple's stock price because the earnings they announced yesterday were better than the year-over-year quarter.

Apr 23, 09 - 04:47 pm Comment from: pastrychef

Meanwhile, MSFT is up over 5% after hours. What am I missing here???

Apr 23, 09 - 04:50 pm Comment from: alansky

Microsloth is a big company, which means that it takes awhile for a slowdown to take effect. Now that the effects of the sea change are becoming visible in the form of concrete earnings reports, it won't be long before Microsoft's perceived influence begins to decline along with its revenues. In the influence game, perception is everything. So long, Microsloth!

Apr 23, 09 - 04:52 pm Comment from: HMCIV

I'd like to have a chair in that board meeting. Wait, no I wouldn't!

Apr 23, 09 - 04:52 pm Comment from: Randian

@Asmodeus

"To play Devil's Advocate, everyone is down this year. Even Apple."

Play all the diabolical games you want. Mac sales were down 3% (late MacBook refreshes/updates), yes, and individual retail store revenues dropped a bit.

HOWEVER . . . and please do pay attention . . . the company (that is, Apple, Inc.) just posted record profits for a non-holiday quarter. Get it? RECORD PROFITS for just about the gillionith quarter in a row, and square in the middle of the very same recession/depression that's beleaguering Microsoft. Hmmm. Spin that in whatever fiendish manner you see fit.

Of course, Vista 7 should fix all that. (Burning sulphur, anyone?)

There are many more "JOBS" out there for Ballmer to deal with...

Apr 23, 09 - 04:59 pm Comment from: ken1w

We've hit the turning point...

Apr 23, 09 - 04:59 pm Comment from: Amazin1

Confused: Well the short explanation is that the market had already accounted for the bad news so now is anticipating better news next quarter.

Microsoft has a long life ahead of it, despite the fact that it may not be as glamorous a life as before. They are so entrenched in so many areas that their rapid death is not going to happen. However, unless they refocus soon, they will just diminish slowly and eventually become irrelevant. Much like Dell. The purchase of Sun by Oracle is going to further erode their enterprise business particularly MS SQL. Slowly but surely the undermining will take its toll.

A word of caution: while Apple's business model has been so successful, it too can come unraveled quickly if the model is not executed consistently and continually. In this world, in this technology frenzy, allowing anything you do to become a commodity, will bring doom.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:00 pm Comment from: Road Warrior

@confused.

The stockholm syndrome can penetrate to the stock market. Another way to look at it is that misery loves company. Or it could be that there are idiots. Or maybe the company is led by a better salesman and who cares about the underlying product. Some people preter a great cover...who cares about the book inside. Or there are these bankers see...and they just got given a whole bunch of money from the government. So why not invest it. Investing is so much fun, a heck of a lot better than say lending the money. Remember some people love to gamble, it is not about winning for them it is about gambling.

Stay tuned to the net for other insights as to why this is happening....

Apr 23, 09 - 05:01 pm Comment from: Anonymous©

MS met expectations of 39cents eps. 6 cents were one-time charges such as layoff costs, so 33cents was the result. I guess investors must have been secretly worrying that results would be worse. That's why the stock is up, after-hours.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:02 pm Comment from: Predrag

For us, Mac users, the important part is the rise in the Mac OS market share. We don't need Mac to represent 50% out there. Even only half of that will be more than enough. Basically, we just need to see Mac OS rise steadily into double-digit percentage globally. This basically ensures that no developer can afford to ignore the platform, and no company can afford to build online presence around MSIE. As much as today's situation is significantly better than ten years ago, when many banks or online retailers refused to work with anything other than IE, every one of us still occasionally comes across a site that breaks in Safari. This MUST be fixed, and it will only get done when the numbers are solid enough. Apparently, they aren't yet, but if we can make anything out of today's and yesterday's numbers from MSFT and AAPL, the trend continues uninterrupted.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:06 pm Comment from: dd

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

Sorry. I got carried away.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...

The fall will take a loooong time. But this news is probably one indicator that the rise of MS has peaked.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:15 pm Comment from: ron

Netbooks, Netbooks, Netbooks, Netbooks, Netbooks, Netbooks!

Apr 23, 09 - 05:16 pm Comment from: Demon

"Of course, Vista 7 should fix all that."

sad part is this is what Microsoft is counting on. But many, many reports on IT Planning say that less then 1% of businesses will upgrade to Windows in the first 12 months after it's released, 67.9% reported that they will only start considering a Windows 7 migration 36 to 48 months after it's release. 2.8% said they planned to migrate to a Windows alternative within 48 months and had no plans to adopt Vista or Windows 7. The remaining IT directors and managers report that they will continue using XP and will keep exploring alternative to Windows for at least 48 months before making a final decision on migrating off of XP.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:17 pm Comment from: Wings2Sky

As a stock owner, I want Apple's market share to grow and grow.
But as an owner, I am really happy now.
It's not like the old days where I wanted Mac shares to grow so that there would be all the software that I want for it.
As long as Apple keeps putting a great product in front of me at a reasonable price, I don't really care about market share.
The others can do what they want - let them eat DOS!

Apr 23, 09 - 05:19 pm Comment from: Rainer

The MSFT stock is up because the market believes there will be more RIFs (buy on bad news (when worse news are not looming).
The rumor has been going for a few days and it will probably continue to hang over the stock until the situation gets better or the RIFs will actually take place (or both).
MSFT is in the stock-portfolio of hundreds of fonds and other investment-vehicles that are pretty much the definition of "long-time". There's not much abrupt change expected.

@confused:

Apple did not come out with a killer product.

Microsoft continued as expected. (Read the headlines: "Micosoft meets low expectations".)

Makes sense?

Na, to me neither. Only think that explains it: Only idiots become analysts.

Today, GM. Tomorrow, MS.

Apr 23, 09 - 05:45 pm Comment from: Dave Marsh

I wonder what they spent $10 billion on to only have a $3 billion profit? They essentially have only two products, Windows and Office, and those are mostly sunk costs that only require a DVD and a box to sell. And I bet their PC hardware vendors don't even get that when they clone the software to their PCs.

At least Apple has to pay vendors for hardware components and assembly. I guess MS does sell mice and joy sticks, but THOSE hardware costs must be off the charts to drive down their profit.

Just wondering...

Apr 23, 09 - 05:49 pm Comment from: Anonymous©

Two things jump out at me, from MS's financials: one, they lost $507M on investments and derivatives. $507M that's a big number. And, two, they lost money on their Xbox/Zune division, down $31M. I guess it's not making money anymore.

Microsoft Gravitational Equation (adapted)

t = sqrt(2d/g)

Where t = time to wait for MS to free fall distance d in measured market relevance.

I wonder how much of that loss is due to replacing broken Xbox 360s.

Apr 23, 09 - 06:36 pm Comment from: Asmodeus

@Randian- you've gone and read wayyyyyyy much more into what I said than what was actually meant. My comment was black and white, and I mean no more than what was said. And I do know the numbers, thank you.

There's no use in defending something that doesn't need defending, my friend.

Apr 23, 09 - 06:51 pm Comment from: Foris

Year over year falls in sales...

MS meets low expectations (well, sorta!)...

The only good financial news is MS's success in downsizing and layoffs...

The major pillar of MS's future financial strength is still a creaky, monolithic old-technology OS which can't be extended and exploited like Apple's...

The money in the bank kitty has shrunk yet again, now a fraction of Apple's...

WTF, if Apple was in this unholy mess, their shares would be down around $50 by now. And I always thought it was the "Jobs Reality Distortion Field".

Could not have happened to a more deserving company. Ray Ozzie will now take a more active role and be positioned as the "savior" of the company. His Groove SW was interesting, but not industry altering innovative (i.e., he's not of savior quality). MS can't change its backwards culture, design, and marketing approach without massive employee turnover, and that won't happen. Ballmer needs to go - he still thinks the mistakenly attributed PT Barnum quote "there's a sucker born every minute" is the way to sell. Problem is, the populous is more educated on technology and sees through the trash MS is trying to shove on the market.

Apr 23, 09 - 07:24 pm Comment from: ericdano

Where is ZUNE TANG???

Apr 23, 09 - 07:34 pm Comment from: Arnold Ziffel

@clunker,

Bingo! I just got off the phone with one of my brothers, and we were saying the exact same thing - MS is the GM of the tech world.

GM has designed so many clunkers in my relatively short lifetime - the Chevy Vega, the Cadillac V8-6-4, their early diesels, you can keep on going down the line. And MS has put out...well, just about everything is some iteration of a chrome-plated turd.

Both companies have had piss poor leadership who've devised horrible business strategies.

Apr 23, 09 - 07:38 pm Comment from: Jubei

Amazing. Their stocks rose 5%...

Apr 23, 09 - 07:44 pm Comment from: Jubei

Huh? What? Yeah really?


"Microsoft Says "I'm a PC" and Laptop Hunters Ads Make People Want Windows More"

"Microsoft said there's a 10 percent increase in preference of Windows PCs as a result of their ad campaigns."

I don't understand why M$ shareholders and employees tolerate Ballmer at the top. He is really a salesman, not a visionary, and they really haven't had a new product in years.
How many more times can Office be upgraded any more?
It's not Mac users choosing the old XP over Vista...its their choir.
The XBox has really never made any money, and the competition is more and more fierce with the Wii and all the mobile games on the App Store.
The IT guys are simply tired of the same old problems and ready for something fresh and even the virus protection gold rush is stagnant.
Apple's stuff is fresh, elegant, intuitive, and shows a modern, smart vision. It is obvious and people will move in droves. It only took bold faith
and a precise pebble to bring Goliath to the ground.

Micro$oft will remain alive as long as IT guys fear losing their jobs.
The money made fixing Windows and virus protecting Windows is greater
than the money made licensing Windows and upgrading Office. It will go
full circle for a long time.
Apple needs to stop at 14% market share...that is plenty enough for them
to do what they do and have sustenance.

Don't buy a Windows PC, buy a Linux one or a Mac.

Don't buy Office anything, OpenOffice for Windows or NeoOffice for Mac's will do the same and read files.

Don't buy M$ hardware, X-Box (near obsolete now) or M$ mice or keyboards.

Don't buy Windows based games, PC 3D gaming is on the way out in favor of consoles (PS3) anyway. Don't blow your money on PC 3D gaming, consoles have come up to their level and then some.

Show off your Mac to others, especially multi-tasking. Most Windows users think they can only do one thing at a time.

And for CRYING OUT LOUD, Get a decent set of desktop images that rotate every few minutes.

If you want to really freak them, get BackLight 2 and run a screensaver (limited choices) as your desktop.

Freak people out even more? Use SnapProZ to Quicktime a movie of iTunes visuals and then use Screensaver maker to convert that into a screensaver. You can have iTunes visuals as a animated desktop using Backlight2.

Insane I know, but cool. Lots of work though. You can do it.

The bigger they are the harder they fall. And congratulations to Apple, Inc. on its 1.21 gigawatts, I mean billion dollars, in quarterly profit.

Apr 23, 09 - 09:17 pm Comment from: MacRaven

I bet Ballmer's armpits were EXTRA sweaty today when he read all these negative M$ articles.

This is the most fun I've ever had reading MDN. Guys, your posts are priceless. My eyes are watering with laughter. Plus some real truths and insight here. What a great read.

Apr 23, 09 - 09:55 pm Comment from: nekogami13

Netbooks are the cause.
Apple wants in on this business why?

Sales of Windows itself were down 16%.
Good job, epicfailBalmer, hyping low cost PCs. Even if the netbook runs Windows, it runs a $15 version not a $60 version.

As noted here, MS and Windows will be around for a long time. But I think this is truly the beginning of a long decline.

Windows is finally in decline, Office will inevitably follow (less necessary going forward.) Nothing on the horizon will ever produce the profits those monopolies once did.

And MS is an absolute failure in the growth markets on the ascent: The Cloud and Mobile. Just as smartphones are taking off, WinMobile is dying. And in the online space, MS makes serious revenue but only with staggering losses. Hint to epicfailbalmer: your strong business franchises were never built on staggering losses.

The future of MS appears to be cutting expenses for higher profits.

Truly the beginning of the end. MS is the new GM though, it'll take a couple of decades for them to die.

Apr 23, 09 - 11:40 pm Comment from: Tiger Leopard

BOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Here's what I don't get. In several articles Microsoft complained that sales Mac Office were down 68% because Mac sales were down. How does a 3% change in hardware cause a 68% drop in software?

Seems to me that Mac users are smart enough to find alternatives to the expensive, over stuffed turkey that is MS Office while MS reps are trying to shuffle off responsibility.

Apr 24, 09 - 12:42 am Comment from: J Lib

@iStepchild and others regarding IT . . .

More and more large companies and institutions are going Linux these days for their server and number crunching needs. The Microsoft stranglehold seems to be most prevalent in smaller office networks and certain industry applications (supermarkets, etc.). Their grip seems to slacken increasingly as time goes by. If people don't adopt Windows 7 in droves, it will be as much an opportunity for Linux as for Apple. If I were in IT these days I'd be learning everything I could about open source, as that seems to be where large scale deployments are headed.

Even when Ballmer does vacate his seat, I don't think a new CEO would be able to straighten out the spaghetti that is Microsoft in anything resembling a short order. Microsoft as we know it is doomed, plain and simple. They are about to become a niche player.

Apr 24, 09 - 01:38 am Comment from: derekcurrie

MICROSOFT ARE GONNA DIE!

It's the beginning of The Decline And Fall Of Microsoft.

If the above disturbs any WinDroids, imagine reading such drivel day after day for two decades. That's the quality of dreck Mac-Hating-Trolls have perpetrated since the day the Mac was released on the market.

So I hope you WinDroids all enjoy the show as Microsoft takes a plummet of its own, the world points fingers, and every day the company's demise is another day closer.

Apr 24, 09 - 02:10 am Comment from: macslut

How is this news?

Microsoft is spending millions of dollars on a massive ad campaign that proves that they literally have to pay people to buy products based on their latest OS.

What kind of business model from hell is that?