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Jul 31, 09 - 11:10 am Comment from: dd

So far, I'm perfectly happy with NeoOffice 3.x. No MS Office on my laptop.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:18 am Comment from: theloniousMac

I turn off XML and stick with 2003/2007 compatibility for PC and Mac anyway.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:18 am Comment from: Mr. Reeee

Oh well.

Rarely I'll use office to solve formatting problems, but I would never, EVER use Office to get real work done! I use iWork for that.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:20 am Comment from: HMCIV

Wow. This is extraordinarily dumb even for Microsoft. Is there another way they can make my life harder?

Jul 31, 09 - 11:20 am Comment from: theloniousMac

Unfortunately I have clients with very complex document formatting so I have to use Word.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:23 am Comment from: RamaFan

I would love to be able to dump all Microsoft file formats, but unfortunately I can't.

My wife still doesn't understand file formats (nor does she really care to learn them) or saving 'out' in different types. Because we use OpenOffice at home she's been very frustrated at me because she can't just shoot somebody an ODT file and have them open it because everybody uses MS Office formats, and it seems we may be having to buy Office just for that purpose.

I can't help but think there are many in the same situation as me; wanting to switch, needing to get out from under Microsoft and yet unable to do so.

I actually rejoiced when they got the XML formats approved as an open format. It may be from Microsoft originally but this will give other applications a chance of using one all-encompassing format that even Office shills can use and understand.

Lets hope they don't pull their usual 'shoot themselves in the foot' crap and kill their own thing here.

That is why I switched to Apple, I just can´t stand this BS.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:30 am Comment from: Jubei

Get iWork and Neo. That's all you need to get the job done and to be compatible to users that are enslaved with Microsloth Office.

@Jubei

Unfortunately, that simply isn't true in the real world. While most simple documents work just fine with the alternative programs, they fall apart quickly for large or complex documents. There simply isn't a realistic alternative to Office yet.

Has anyone here TRIED to open Windows-created OpenXML files with Office 2008 SP2? Because I'm having no problems at all; it seems like this might not be an everyone's-experiencing-it problem, and it's amazing how many people here are reacting without trying it.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:41 am Comment from: G4Dualie

An easy fix for those using Time Machine.

Clearly, the right-hand knows not what the left is doing. Or perhaps its more sinister than that.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:43 am Comment from: G4Dualie

@Ronin

There simply isn't a realistic alternative to Office yet.

That's right. As long as Microsoft dictates the standard there never will be parity.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:43 am Comment from: Jay-Z

Oh for the love. As if it weren't bad enough I have Office forced down my throat in the first place.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:45 am Comment from: HolyMackerel

iWork for new documents that need a professional look.
NeoOffice for legacy documents and sending/receiving from clients.

Works fine with our Exchange/Office environment, zero complaints with documents sent out via a Mac. All the complaints are PC to PC with docx, xlsx and pptx formatting.

If you have to upgrade for Win 7 and Office 2007, then why not just move to a Mac?

What a disappointment. Microsoft should try being more open and compatible like Apple.

@ RamaFan - For read-only documents, have your wife use the Mac's "print to PDF" functionality. Everyone can read PDFs.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:51 am Comment from: G4Dualie

@Jason

Because I'm having no problems at all; it seems like this might not be an everyone's-experiencing-it problem

The article stated as much; it's an intermittent problem, one that is not uniform across the Mac platform.

Perhaps you installed Office with just the right combination of features from the list of install options that SP2 saw fit to leave in tack.

Jul 31, 09 - 11:54 am Comment from: Wings2Sky

Well, you can't really blame M$. I mean, who would have thought to test cross-platform compatibility? In the SP2, they fixed what was broken in SP1. Isn't that good enough for you? Gees, you mac guys are so spoiled!

Jul 31, 09 - 11:55 am Comment from: BC Kelly

Watch Your Ass Folks

First thought, then confirmed after reading a comment via link to full story's site

Maybe deliberate to screw with Mac ?

When does (did?) that "agreement" with Microsoft expire ?

And "agreement" or not, can Microsoft ever be trusted to "do the right thing" for Mac ?

Or anyone but Microsoft ?

Cover Your Butt


BC

Jul 31, 09 - 11:58 am Comment from: qka

@G4Dualie

That's right. As long as Microsoft dictates the standard there never will be parity.

And until Apple and all the "competitors" sit on their ass and do not add the features the real world needs, Microsoft has the field to themselves.

Can anyone who to automatically generate a table of contents in Pages? Index?

There actually IS an alternative for MS Office for Mac. I've been using Mariner Software's Write and Calc apps for a while now and love them!

Can anyone tell me whether or not people who are strictly Windows have been able to open iWork docs and Neo docs when sent from a Mac to Windows via email? I get a huge amount of people telling me they can't open the docs I send them. I only use Neo but have been tempted to start using iWork which I always get anytime there is a new one updated !! Please advise or comment !! Thanks, Taz

Jul 31, 09 - 12:06 pm Comment from: HolyMackerel

@ Taz
NeoOffice is an OpenOffice clone and as such has .odt as the default document type. This can be changed to .doc or .docx in the preferences for new documents or on a document-by-document basis.

I send hundreds of NeoOffice created/edited documents in Office 97 .doc and .xls format and everyone in the UK government offices and construction employers I send to have been able to read them all. I am not sure about .ppt nor the .docx/.xlsx/.pptx formats as I have no experience in this.

I like iWork Pages and Numbers. However, they are not fully compatible enough with MS Office files for my needs both for reading and for writing. iWork won't always read in correctly and I'm told that people who tried to open iWork files written out as Office files found strange differences. I recently went to Mac Office 2008 and automatically applied SP2 and then found I couldn't read the docx files so I re-instaled and manually applied just SP1 and am now fine.

Generally I'm finding I like Office 2008. It doesn't seem substantially worse than earlier versions of Office. iWork is cleaner but I wouldn't say Office is horrible on the Mac either.

Jul 31, 09 - 12:09 pm Comment from: noxlady

@RamaFan

I use NeoOffice, and in the preferences I'm able to set the default format in which files are to be saved. I set mine to .doc and .xls so as to be compatible with my coworkers... You could do that for your wife and it would be entirely transparent for her

Bummer with iWork is that you can't simple save as a .doc, it must always be a Save As... :(

I wonder if a Linux version of iWork, would be game over for Ballmy?

It would seem to endorse a Linux GUI, and finally turn the Linux environment into a free Wang-style 'office' computer — much like what the Windows/Office combo is currently.

It gets everybody off of Apple's back to release OS X for generic PCs.

They'd likely have to give it away, on the Mac and Linux. But they give away iLife. And, that package of software, easily costs Apple as much to produce as iWork — or more.

I'd pay 30 bucks more for any new Mac, if iWork came with a free pre-install. I think most Mac people would.

Call it something else if need be.

And include Mail and Safari.

This obviously wouldn't help Apple, as much as it would hurt MS.

Jul 31, 09 - 12:29 pm Comment from: REALTORben

By the way, if anyone didn't buy office 2008, but was still using it via a serial number discovered somewhere on line, the SP2 update also disables your version of Office.

Alas, who cares, iWork is better!

Jul 31, 09 - 12:39 pm Comment from: jocknerd

Its time for apple to get on the bandwagon and support Open Document Format. No excuse why iWork '09 doesn't support that.

This is the crux of the matter. Without Office, there is no need for Windows. So the question is , how to wean peopel off of Office (There's something metaphorical about this question that can be applied to our society in general, but I digress.)? What people cannot agree on are - IS Office the best office ware? Or are people so conditioned by the way MSFT want you to work they never think of a better or alternative way of the doing things? Some people believe, for example, the use and mental dependency on the Power Point paradigm have hugely detrimental effects on how information is presented and people are led to think.

Jul 31, 09 - 12:46 pm Comment from: Rob

Nice, so basically they are saying: "You bought our product, now you can go back to using the old one."
Money well spent.

Jul 31, 09 - 12:56 pm Comment from: El Guapo

@qka

And until Apple and all the "competitors" sit on their ass and do not add the features the real world needs, Microsoft has the field to themselves.

Can anyone who to automatically generate a table of contents in Pages? Index?

What?

Jul 31, 09 - 12:57 pm Comment from: Beowulf

The only reason that I have MS Office on my MBP is so my wife can use PowerPoint for her school class presentations. She can use the Front Row remote that came with my laptop to run the presentation. Can you do this with NeoOffice?

Jul 31, 09 - 01:30 pm Comment from: Snow Leopard

@Beowulf, you can and with better results using Keynote in iWork. Plus, your wife can use her iPhone to remotely control the presentation in Keynote.

Jul 31, 09 - 02:07 pm Comment from: ken1w

What? Microsoft did not even test file compatibility between their own products. Microsoft is profiting from a good percentage of Mac users, because they buy Office for Mac. That's not going to last too long with carelessness like this.

Jul 31, 09 - 02:09 pm Comment from: Beowulf

@ Snow Leopard, we don't have an iPhone...yet. lol She uses MS PP because she's used to it. Which means I have to let this MS garbage infest my otherwise pristine MBP. I've tried to get her to switch over to Keynote but she doesn't want to learn the other little nuances that Keynote has.

Jul 31, 09 - 02:22 pm Comment from: LateRegistrant

Neither NeoOffice nor SunOffice could properly open a 36MB .docx file that was sent to me recently. I use Word 2004 but the latest MS translator couldn't do the job, either. The file had many graphics which had been evidently turned off. Pages'09 swiftly translated the document and revealed the graphics.

Later I learned there were small differences between the Pages document and the original .docx file, but Pages had saved the day by delivering the information that I was after in a hurry.

have to admit, we use MS Office constantly here - both 2003 for the PC and 2004 for the Mac.

Thankfully, our IT team listens to us and isn't pushing everyone to adopt the latest offerings from Redmond. There is absolutely no reason to use the latest versions of MS Office -- NONE. Save your time and money, use older more stable versions.

Jul 31, 09 - 02:51 pm Comment from: Micro Me

I upgraded with SP2 and soon encountered this error when I was unable to open an .xlsx file emailed to me. I wondered what the sender or I had done wrong. Now I know. Nothing.

This seems like a fairly basic and major error. I'm not happy, MBU.

Ballmer :
"We have low share, by the way, in the investor audience. I can see the Apple logos versus the PC logos. So we have more work to do, more work to do. Our share is lower in this audience than the average audience. Don’t hide it. I’ve already counted them. I have been doing that since we started talking."

"Anyway, we got a bank them right here in the middle. I know where they all are. One over here on the side. But anyway… that’s okay, feel free as long as you are using Office to go right on ahead."

Maybe they are using Office...
Thanks a$$hole. Y'all broke that, too.

More dodgy code from the photocopy company.

So, yesterday he was wanting Mac users to use Office but since it's virtuously useless, who's going to waste the $$ to go there.

Jul 31, 09 - 09:21 pm Comment from: silverhawk

Maybe Apple needs to finish iWork (index, etc.). Then make a $79 dollar version for windows.

Jul 31, 09 - 09:31 pm Comment from: alansky

SP2 also trashes bootleg Office serial numbers. Not that anyone who frequents this website would even dream of using an unauthorized copy of Office.

Aug 01, 09 - 03:33 am Comment from: hagar57

Do they still make MS Office? What for?

Aug 01, 09 - 05:22 am Comment from: almux

Stupid M$, as usually.
Better go for OpenOffice.org... It's free, works fine AND is making cross platform .docs

Aug 02, 09 - 06:15 am Comment from: enzos

Office 2008 is about as snappy as a wet blanket. Office 2004, with all the patches and updates, is snappy (snappier than iWork) and still respects embedded objects (try copy-paste editing 3rd party graphics in Orifice 2008 - it doesn't work [dammit!]!). 2008 is the the Word 96 for Mac of the naughties. And this .docx thing (the reason I tried 2008) is a farce.

Not that anyone who frequents this website would even dream of using an unauthorized copy of Office.

I don't use it, period. The only way I'd consider doing so would be if I someone paid me to, and it wouldn't be cheap.

-jcr

I'm proudly free of all MicroSlop software since 2004

Life can be sweet without MS