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a lot of people are thinking 3G is the holly grail, they will be disappointed, its coverage is worse than edge and rarely is the data rate that much better, plus it will drain the battery more. Im keeping hold of 1st gen for now. o2 3g users in the uk usually get a worse rate than the edge users because only the big business customers actually get higher data rates.

Only in the USA. every where else 3g is not only widely available but they are already installing 4g services. When it comes to cell phone tech the USA is generally 3 steps behind europe, and 4 steps behind japan. Releasing a 3G iPhone will open up about 50 million more potential buyers in europe alone.

I personally am waiting for the 3g service. as edge in my area sucks, dial up with a commodore 64 works better.

Apr 06, 08 - 10:51 am Comment from: gzero

@bob,

It depends on which "3G" technology is incorporated. 3G will indeed spark sales of the iPhone in countries outside of the US, especially in Europe and Asia, where it's more widespread.

As Uncle Walt alluded to in the video, 3G coverage in the US is quite pathetic compared to the rest of the world (Germany is the low man on the European broadband totem pole, but 3G coverage here is still vastly superior to that in the US), so what you write is absolutely correct.

I am in UK, europe, and 3G coverage sucks whatever anyone else says on the internet.

This 2.5G/3G stuff is irritating me.

Its about the frickin ability of the cell phone companies to recieve and transmit signals.
In some areas no G at all will help, in others its fine.
The logic is easy - make sure that the areas most dense with customers get the most signal masts, and slowly spend the cash to cover the sparse areas. Slowly.

That is NOT going to change. If you live in Bumf**k Idaho, dont worry about 3G or any kind of 'G'.

As for surfing on the phone signal - I dont care what you've got, its NOT going to be like your connection at home.

Remember that most, if not ALL of the other phones are crap and no-one actually surfed the web until the iPhone.

I just dont get it - the best phone imaginable, the iPhone, and still the whining continues.

Bunch of entitled little wankers, IMHO.

As for the Europeans, inc. the UK, they come on here and post like they have some special 3G service thats so much better in Europe.
Actually, NO they dont.
They also, have not had a real computer phone before, because the iPhone is the only phone that does what it does.

Dont believe me? Go and buy a frickin N95 and see how CRAP it is. You wont be doing any surfin' baby.

Enough with the '3G' bs - I imagine I am not the only one who thinks this is another media crapfest - all yap and no truth.

Apr 06, 08 - 11:59 am Comment from: Mr. Reeee

I tend to believe Walt on this one. It would also make sense for Apple to release a new iPhone PRIOR to WWDC so they can focus on future Mac developments and not get sidetracked with iPhone news.

Apple might surprise everyone and release a 4G phone instead of 3G. There have been rumors of low-power 4G (and 3G) chipsets being released soon, if they're not available already.

Is 4G backward compatible with 3G?

Apr 06, 08 - 11:59 am Comment from: TowerTone

For anyone who wants to compare the US to "other" countries, you might want to consider the size and population density. In the US, you expect to get adequate service in most places, and it has to be the same, so the initial investment by phone companies is greater.

I don't really believe 3G is going to be that great. It may be better, and it will continue to be rolled out, but with their eyes set on 4g 700 MHz band, I think we will finally get to the Holy Grail of bandwidth. It still won't be a mobile T1, and it will be spotty, too, but it should be very adequate for the next decade.

I just hope we don't have to wait too long beyond 2010-2011 to start having this experience.

Yes Bob, thing is that someone is always on the internet.

El Grugo
Great to hear that there's still people who enjoys their 14.4k modems.

"Yes Bob, thing is that someone is always on the internet."

whatever, not whenever

@ El Gruga

"As for the Europeans, inc. the UK, they come on here and post like they have some special 3G service thats so much better in Europe. Actually, NO they dont."

Actually - YES we do! It's far more available and has been for a long time. And as for surfing on an N95, I agree, I wouldn't compare that with the experience you'd get on an iPhone, but you can hook up your MacBook to the phone and use it as a 3G modem. I can tell you from experience, it's fast. Some companies are offering 7 mps connections, which is comparable to home connections (and sometimes even better).

So enough of the Xenophobic ill-informed opinion, please. People in the UK (and anywhere else) are entitled to "come on here and post". You see, that's the great thing about the WORLD WIDE web - it's accessible outside the States too.

I think you are confusing peoples' enthusiasm and hopes for improvements as criticisms. What's wrong with wanting better functionality? Luddite!

Apr 06, 08 - 12:48 pm Comment from: bond co. stooge

Strictly for illustrative purposes only; no flame-bait whatsoever:

UK approx 260,000 km sq.
Texas, 695,000

As much as I can't stand telcos, I will forgo chalk and cheese comparisons and give them a break on sheer size alone. Covering the entire country, or even just major population centers, is an ENORMOUS task.

That said, I do believe Apple will release the 3g as an option, especially in those markets where it makes sense.

For the US, I'd like to see the efforts put into greater wifi accessibility/coverage instead.

.02

Apr 06, 08 - 12:51 pm Comment from: Reality Check

@ El Gruga
"As for the Europeans, inc. the UK, they come on here and post like they have some special 3G service thats so much better in Europe. Actually, NO they dont."

What? Here is the Netherlands EDGE has even been discontinued as a service, it's so outdated. There's 3G coverage everywhere. Speaking as a Brit living in The Netherlands, I'd like to point out to my fellow countrymen that there is life outside Blighty and, despite rumours spread by the Conservative Party, most of it is considerably more advanced and sophisticated than in the UK.

Apr 06, 08 - 01:09 pm Comment from: flappo

err , except labour have been in power since 1997.. don't blame the tories for tony's mess ups

I've had a USB thing to stick in my MBP for more than a ear.

It works fine in the UK, but I can count the number of times I've been in a 3G zones on the fingers of one hand.

Nice to have, but don't imagine it's everywhere that's all.

Apr 06, 08 - 01:34 pm Comment from: Macintosh

Of course it's coming in June. Why would it come out before the software that it will be best suited for? Why would Apple want to hold two launch events so close together?

Apr 06, 08 - 01:55 pm Comment from: DogGone

The most poignant comment here is that 3G will open up the iPhone to more countries and spread adoption where 3G is common.

Apr 06, 08 - 02:24 pm Comment from: grh

Nothing's changed regarding my own situation. Despite taking second place to no one when it comes to Apple evangelism, I will NOT buy an iPhone. I travel a lot and have mobile numbers in six different countries. I will not tolerate a phone that cannot take different SIM cards. Roaming is an idiotic "solution" and I don't like the idea of hacking, being that it is not authorized and therefore at risk of being locked out by Apple at any time.

Apple is usually god-like brilliance. But the decision to lock a user into one carrier and demand a share of the revenue is stunningly unreasonable and greedy. Shame on Apple and why the hell aren't more people protesting it?

Apr 06, 08 - 02:29 pm Comment from: ericdano

It's not going to be a 3G phone. It will have that dual band EDGE thing where it can essentially double the rate that it gets off of EDGE right now. It might have a GPS though.

They will do this because AT&T;is going to skip 3G and just start rolling out over the next year or two. And we won't see that in the iPhone till next year.

@grh

who give a fat rats ass. go buy a moto piece of shit and carry your whining ass

Apr 06, 08 - 02:47 pm Comment from: R

It's about usability. If 3G won't really make things better in real world behavior-- unless Apple knows something about AT&T;'s possible future network changes-- it could very well stay 2.5G.

One way or another, I'll be getting one this Fall.

Apr 06, 08 - 02:55 pm Comment from: freefromdesign

No 3g coverage where I live, unless the second gen phone has a bunch of cool new features, i'm sticking with mine

Apr 06, 08 - 02:59 pm Comment from: silverhawk

@grh
"...why the hell aren't more people protesting it?"

I'm not protesting because I own Apple stock. A new revenue stream is a good thing!

Apr 06, 08 - 03:16 pm Comment from: deepdish

excellent video. the whole thing was interesting. I wonder what the other people in the room were thinking?

Apr 06, 08 - 03:17 pm Comment from: Sixvodkas

@bob,

I dated a holly once and never thought her the Grail, much less the 3G.

Care to elaborate?

3G IS CRAP. SPOTTY COVERAGE, SUCKS THE LIFE OUT OF BATTERIES, AND IT REALLY ISNT THAT FAST!! WiMaxx will save us.

Apr 06, 08 - 03:28 pm Comment from: emanon

3G may suck when it comes to battery life, but with the new low-power 3G chips and the rumoured OLED display, I don't think it will be an issue.

Is 3G about speed of the internet, etc?

I am looking for TV and GPS and enhanced versions of existing iPhone apps.

Speed increases will come but I have to live long enough.

Still a geeking geezer, I guess.

@grh

I travel out of the US relatively frequently (about once per quarter). I am often irritated that I can't use my iPhone when I travel without rates of $1.99 (US) per minute. My solution has been to carry a second phone that is unlocked and use my local SIM cards with that phone. It is frustrating, but it is what it is. I bought the iPhone fully aware that I would be faced with that constraint. I wish it wasn't so, but it is.

I do appreciate your concern though. I am an avid supporter and user of Apple products - Desktop, laptop, iPhone... For me though, I wish Apple would allow the iPhone to sync wirelessly with .MAC. To get wireless sync, I would have to use MS Exchange (as of June) and Entourage. Talk about Apple giving greater support to an MS product over their own! That is more important to me than unlocking for overseas.

AT&T;- all new phones are 3G

Replaced my RAZR with a new one when the old one got lost. Checked out the SIM card, 3G. Sure as the sun rises everyday.

Also AT&T;is offering 3G wireless cards, even for MacBook Pro's, it's faster than DSL!

3G is fast, DON'T, REPEAT DON'T, believe the BS you read here about 2 or 2.5/Edge being "good enough" it's not.

The smart ones are waiting for iPhone 2.0 and 3G plus a few more necessities, like business apps and VOIP.

Keep waiting, it's the SMART MOVE. Why pay $600 for a phone that will be obsolete so soon?

Wait for iPhone 2.0, it's coming soon, then buy.

Obsolete? LOL
No, but your logic is. My iPhone will be vastly more functional and useful than any non-iPhone for quite a few years (tons of inferior phones have more features implemented with ZERO effort toward integration...).

A faster iPhone is great - but it's not a vast difference.

The fact that my current car doesn't accelerate as fast as the newer models does NOT make my car obsolete in any way, shape or form.

Apr 06, 08 - 05:41 pm Comment from: LukeinOz

@bond co. stooge:

Strictly for illustrative purposes only; no flame-bait whatsoever:

UK approx 260,000 km sq.
Texas, 695,000

As much as I can't stand telcos, I will forgo chalk and cheese comparisons and give them a break on sheer size alone. Covering the entire country, or even just major population centers, is an ENORMOUS task.

No flame intent here either:

I wont compare state by state - but Australia is nearly as large as the US (Aus - 7.9 million square kilometers vs. US 9.8 million)

And our telcos cover almost 95% of the population by 3G services with 100% in the major cities (and getting better).

We should also note that Australia only has about 21 million (about the state of New York) people compared to the US population of 300 million, so we only have 7% of the paying customers to build that coverage!

On a customer per/square kilometer basis (31 per square kilometer for the US vs. 2.7 per square kilometer for Australia), there is no reason for this.

Now I know some will say - well it is easy when most of the population lives in cities, but I have to say, even within those cities the coverage maps for Australian GSM, EDGA and 3G looks much better than those for major American cities.

I admire the US on so many levels, but your telecommunications infrastructure and technology is behind, there is no way to sugar coat it.

Instead of getting defensive against us foreigners for pointing it out, get ANGRY at your telcos and politicians for allowing this to happen.

We foreigners would be quite happy for you to catch up, or even overtake us, as you are a huge market, and as such if you were in step with us, technology would become cheaper everywhere, and you would benefit from a better service.

My 2 cents,

Luke

This video needs to be watched in its entirety. Walt brings up some interesting points. The 3G thing wasn't surprising- i knew it was all hipe but the broadband issue- and eye opener for me.

anyway- Worth listening to. Quite noteworthy at any rate.

"I don't really believe 3G is going to be that great."

3G is here. 1-2 megabits per second downloads in real world conditions. Why would you iPhone plonkers stick with EDGE while the rest of AT&T;'s customers can use 3G connections? Because you have no choice.

Apr 06, 08 - 08:00 pm Comment from: Alexo

Umm, population USA around 380million, population rest of planet Earth 6.6 billion. Why wouldn't Apple, a global player, build a 3G phone for the rest of us?

Having owned a 1st Generation iPhone using EDGE for some time now in Australia, it just doesn't cut it for speed compared to the 3G card plugged into my MacBook Pro. When Wi-Fi networks are not available (which seems to be most of the time when away from home), EDGE is just too slow for a decent surfing experience. And 3G seems to be just about everywhere in Asia and Australia.

Whoever said iPhone surfing will never be as good as at home is dead wrong. 3G here is currently @ 7+ Mb/s and rapidly heading for 30+ Mb/s. 2G iPhones will sell alongside 3G and 4G iPhones. They'll eventually come in flip format and all sorts of colors and sizes too. Just think of the iPod lineup to see how Apple will extend it's iPhone lineup. Then buy the one that takes your fancy, fits your lifestyle and location's infrastructure, and of course, your budget. Like iPod, they'll all be good!

"They will do this because AT&T;is going to skip 3G"

AT&T;already has a widely deployed 3G network. You just can't use it because you have an iPhone.

Yeesh, why is everyone arguing about a wireless protocol that'll be obsolete soon enough?

The real news is Walt spilled the beans. BAD move Walt, NObody takes the thunder from an Apple roll-out!!

It was nice having Mr. Mossberg as an Apple guy. Hope he had clearance from Apple to "leak" this, because the Wrath of Jobs ain't pretty.

"Yeesh, why is everyone arguing about a wireless protocol that'll be obsolete soon enough?"

Perhaps because the Internet experience between 2G and 3G is as significantly different as the Internet experience between dial up and broadband.

"Yeesh, why is everyone arguing about a wireless protocol that'll be obsolete soon enough?"

And because while 4G networks are being defined now, it will be a while before they are rolled out. And if history is a predictor of the future it will be even longer after everybody else makes a 4G phone before Apple finally makes one.

Apr 06, 08 - 09:24 pm Comment from: Zune Tang®

What Mossberg failed to mention is that Verizon will soon use '3G-WM Live Edition' for their line of Windows Mobile based phones. Microsoft has cleverly created a broadband network layer which runs in conjunction with 3G which allows for enhanced streaming of WMV content on Verizon's V-CAST. You get the ads for free and there's a holographic sticker on each of these phones to certify they're 3G-WM Live Edition enabled. Rumors are flying that Verizon secured exclusive rights to the original 'Lost in Space' TV series. That Dr. Smith. What a hoot! Never cared for that pesky little kid though.

Fortunate Verizon users get Microsoft enhanced broadband networking to play another magnificent Microsoft file format on a Microsoft Windows Mobile based phone. The pieces are really coming together. All I can say is suck it, MAC dorks.

Your potential. Our passion.™

Apr 06, 08 - 10:01 pm Comment from: TowerTone

@stupid TowerTone

you asked
"Why would you iPhone plonkers stick with EDGE while the rest of AT&T;'s customers can use 3G connections?

and then stated
"Because you have no choice."

Well, the whole point of this discussion is about Apple releasing a 3G iPhone. And then we will have a choice. I have decided that when they offer a 32 GB version, I will buy it.

My point about 3G "not being so great" is when compared to the 700 MHz band (they ROCK!).
Anyhow, when that roll out begins, it will overshadow 3G more than 3G does 2.5G. Capiche?

Oh, and I hope you didn't strain anything as you patted yourself on the back while stroking yourself on the front.......

Apr 06, 08 - 10:03 pm Comment from: Macromancer

"a lot of people are thinking 3G is the holly grail, they will be disappointed,"

Doesn't matter. As soon as 3G becomes available on the iPhone all the iPhone wanna be owners will declare they are waiting for the superior 4G.

I'll just be happy to get the iPhone in Canada :-{

and wifi is still inferior to wifi, so... yawn...

Apr 07, 08 - 01:59 am Comment from: Dialtone

For the past couple weeks I've been traveling all over the country (USA) and have found AT&T;'s Edge service to be pretty darn ubiquitous. I've only lost it in some parts of rural Virginia and inside big steel buildings. Just having *any* connection, even just Edge, is a transformative experience for the weary traveler. We checked train schedules, looked-up play reviews, made secure money transfers, showed a shuttle driver where we wanted to go (with the map), checked weather, news, mail, sent photos and on and on....

Apr 07, 08 - 03:56 am Comment from: Petey

In my experience with 3g in the UK I believe its a total waste of time.

As well as the coverage issues, the service sucks and and you look at your monthly bill if you use 3g - you are gonna be surprised how high your bill will be.

3g is overhyped for what it is and ironically Apple got it totally correct with wifi.

Wifi compared with 3g is cheaper, faster and doesnt drain your battery as much either.

So am I waiting for a 3g iphone?

Nope I aint because I know how little difference it will make AND if you have a wifi access point you will find you never use 3g anyway!

With all due respect, most Americans know nothing about mobile phones so please you guys stop blabbering. Can you believe that ANALOG still even exists in the States??? Or has taken THIS long to die off???

3G is prevalent in Asia. We use 3G on a daily basis, to do video conferencing over mobile phones. To Americans this is incredible technology!

Dudes, you can surf on the Internet over 3G, supplied to your MacBook Pro via an ExpressCard HSDPA gizmo.

3G iPhone will be launched in Asia. That is my prediction.

An Asian Techie.

So what I am reading here is that 3G sucks for the USA and for the UK.

(Hahahaha).

Enjoy your, ah, Wi-Fi. The rest of us in Europe and Asia will be very happy surfing wireless BROADBAND anywhere we go. I hope they have iChat AV on the new 3G iPhone. (I reckon they will!)

The only reason you guys (USA and UK) are SO BEHIND in mobile services is because you have LOW STANDARDS of your telcos. Stop buying and using the crap and they will have to build new infrastructure. It's pretty simple.

Asian Techie.

Apr 07, 08 - 04:20 am Comment from: justme2

I rarely have trouble with EDGE for the surfing I do away from WiFi connections -- the only problem is not being able to pick up Flash videos on web pages, but I know that's more an Adobe/Apple issue (Apple should've just bought Adobe years ago and made it a wholly owned subsidiary).

@Asian Techie -- The genie's pretty much out of the bottle as far as putting up with inferior infrastructure; the telecoms are too busy now trying to cover their posteriors for going along with the government's requests for wiretapping and information.

Apr 07, 08 - 05:35 am Comment from: R

3G will be good for me in the US because I'll have strong coverage. My city's basically the size of Europe.