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Thats what i love about the iPhone.. Updates!

makes sense.

for now I will trust his judgement on controlling all of the software on it.

Get the fsck out of here. You can't upgrade to 3G with a software update. It either has a UMTS/HSDPA chipset or it doesn't. If it did have one, why the hell wouldn't Apple say so?

Good thing you weren't on the development team, R2.

Look, you want to have your Mac fanboy dreams then go ahead. But I wouldn't advise you to go around preaching how the iPhone can be upgraded to 3G with a software update.

they WANT to activate VOIP but cingular is in the way! by activating such a feature would mean that consumers could eventually bypass cingular's data network.

There is a reason why there is no 3G but there is a 3G chip inside. reasons to be heard later.

It's the same thing as the update that is with Apple TV or with the new router, to activate 802.11n.

Same way the wifi in current imacs are software upgraded (or turned on) to 802.11n

Steve put goodies in, but left them off for later activation.

When I first heard about the iPhone, I thought it came with the ability to talk using the internet...

R2,

Sorry, I must have missed your detailed dissection of Apple's iPhone. Obviously, you know all about what's inside the device. Please point me to your link (hope you have photos, too).

Thanks in advance.

Of course, if Apple's software elves are thinking at the top of their game (and the phone's hardware is good enough), they could create a virtual OS X "box" within the iPhone's own OS X environment that could be used by corporate application developers, whilst "retail" apps that Apple have approved as "Works with iPhone" get to work in the standard "host" space.

Anyone know if that approach is possible?

Yeah yeah, Fred. The biggest complaint about the iPhone is lack of 3G and now fanboys like yourself wish to claim "there's a 3G chip in there but Apple left it inactive." Just like the Zune fanboys who love to say Microsoft software updates will later enable it to wipe my ass.

Looks like that Reality Distortion Field does exist.

I hope this is not going to be "Cube, Part Deux."

So many barriers to entry, they better remove as many as possible before launch.

"It either has a UMTS/HSDPA chipset or it doesn't. If it did have one, why the hell wouldn't Apple say so?"

Umm, maybe because Apple isn't ready to actually use it yet due to issues with Cingular's network?? Look, nobody will know the answer to that for sure until the iPhone is actually released in June anyway, so just calm down dude.

Fanatic Realist: Yeah, Microsoft has been doing it for years. Internal API's for their own apps, public API's for everyone else's... that's why their products seem faster and more stable than the competition. Heck it's even been discovered that the public API's have done nothing but cause a short random delay and then call the private one. It'd rather hope that Apple NOT copy them.

Who gives a sh*t whether it has 3G built-in or not. The iPhone kicks the @ss of anything that Microsoft, Motorola, Palm or anybody else has ever come up with anyway. No sense in getting all anal over this R2D2.

Don.

Did I say different APIs?

I said virtualised "box", similar to Parallel's Workstation or VMWare or, dare I say it, Classic.

By creating a virtual "sandbox" for independently developed applications, Apple can deliver a "smartphone" that can develop a "vertical" life of its own.

I don't care, BaD.

I don't care that the 1st Generation iPhone doesn't have 3G. I never wanted that shit to begin with. Take out the cellular aspect, replace it with an 80gb hard disk and now we're talking (no pun intended).

How many Macs shipped with 802.11 AirPort cards before Apple acknowledged that they upgraded them?

I'm sorry, I meant 802.11n cards.

R2 likes buttons to push! Leave him alone in his own fantasy world. He needs to stay with his comfort zone. It is just too bad he can't recognize a good thing when it up and slaps him on the side of the head. Some people really do like windoze. I have friends who still have the rotary dial phones.

To add to Don's comment (public vs. private API's)....

IBM started this back in the day of punchcard readers. There were two types of customers, banks and S&Ls;. The banks bought the high-speed card reader and the S&L;'s bought the more affordable, slower one. Turned out the slower one was just the same as the fast one, but with a governor on the motor to restrict RPM's.

I am skeptical of this report since it's unlikely that the chip is there but unused. It pushes the price of components upwards for no good reason. However, saying that it's impossible for certain and even name calling posters is childish. Apple didn't even want to mention what kind of CPU powers the iPhone, what makes people think they want to tell what kind of communication chips are in it or not. So, though it's unlikely, it's not impossible either.

Aside from select people inside Apple working on iPhone integration, no one has all the answers. An Apple executive even said that it was powered by an Intel chip and Intel promptly issued a denial. People, especially Apple outsiders, should stop turning speculations to certainty.

I've probably given Apple more of my money over the past two years than you have all your life, opie. Please let's not take it there because I'll certainly smack the shit out of you. We can start scanning receipts right now.

I have a phone that works fine. I don't like Cingular's service. I want a widescreen, touchscreen iPod with a 30gb+ hard drive and will pay any price to have one. It's that simple. I have no bias against Apple or the iPhone. I love the former and think the latter is an excellent product with or without 3G.

Re: Skype-likeness

... just wait for leopard. I give you a three-finger guarantee it'll be there.

"they WANT to activate VOIP but cingular is in the way! by activating such a feature would mean that consumers could eventually bypass cingular's data network.

There is a reason why there is no 3G but there is a 3G chip inside. reasons to be heard later."

You're a lawyer for Cisco, aren't you? ^_^

While I'm also a wishful thinker, hoping that the 3G aspect has already been incorporated, and only needs to be activated like the recent 802.11 cards in the latest iMacs, i also doubt it. 1) Cost, and 2) Apple wants as many people to use it asap.

So i actually give credit to R2 for being able to see this picture, and reiterate his wish for a 80B widescreen video ipod. Afterall, if you wanna see good movies, you dont want to keep syncing to download another movie to it later. Its just a clever way of getting as many people as possible to buy the iPhone for any of the 3 key reasons Jobs demonstrated.

Again, due to Apple's secrecy on roadmaps, maybe there will be a full 80GB+ widescreen ipod with the same Multi-touch interface. No one will know, and while we can all guess and stress each other out with aggressive comments, it wont actually get us any closer to the truth.

************************

Jobs directly said that there is not a small order or uniquely designed silicon. So jointed GSM/3G chip is by far not something impossible. There is nothing that would make joining two things together impossible.

************************

However, this variant that iPhone a actually supports 3G is not much probable, since Cingular would be only glad to have it and, hence, Jobs would tell about it without hesitation.

"The last thing you want is to have loaded three apps on your phone and then you go to make a call and it doesn’t work anymore."

Whoa. Is OS X that unstable that running an app could bring down the whole OS?!

R2 is correct. 3G is an entirely different chipset. If the iPhone starts with EDGE it cannot be upgraded to 3G via software.

"During an interview on Tuesday, he said that Apple had not decided whether to enable a voice-over-Internet service like Skype."

See, there's the problem I have with this. Needless to say, Apple will decide who gets to do stuff and who doesn't. So I want to do Adium for the iPhone--nope, sorry, Apple is doing iChat. So I have this great idea for an app for the iPhone. I present it to Apple and am told to get stuffed. Three months later, Apple comes out with my idea (because they'd had the same idea? Or they said, 'Hey, yeah, that is a good idea! Thanks!').

Correction:

...

Jobs directly said that there is not a small order ***OF*** uniquely designed silicon.

...

**Economan**: not necessary; Jobs directly said that there is specifically designed silicon in iPhone. There is no problem to have two chips merged in one.

**Peter**: having or not iChat on iPhone has nothing to do with to do with whatever ideas until Cingular will losing money if people will not pay to them for SMS. The same is with VoIP versus Cingular.

Also, Jobs never said MacOS X will hang with those three applications. Hovewer, such applications can become processor resources heavy and that may interfere with basic functions of the phone. MacOS X's stability has nothing to do with it; it will be fine.

Simultaneously, Jobs said it is Cingular's fear that unknown and untested applications may cause glitches to the cell network or overload it with sending whatever (malicious or not) information.

So it was hardly purely Apple's decision to close completely iPhone platform.

"Umm, maybe because Apple isn't ready to actually use it yet due to issues with Cingular's network??"

Yet Cingiular has many other 3G models working.

The only conceivable possibilities are 1) It's not 3G capable.

2) It is but the software is not ready. given that the phone is vaporware today, what would be the harm in announcing that when it finally ships it will be 3G upgradable?

"I don't care that the 1st Generation iPhone doesn't have 3G. I never wanted that shit to begin with."

You're right, Lightning fast music download to the phone, streaming music and video plus fast mobile Internet would really suck.

...“That doesn’t mean there’s not going to be software to buy that you can load on them coming from us. It doesn’t mean we have to write it all, but it means it has to be more of a controlled environment.”

There you go! They are not going to write all the softwares so third-party app is a possiblility! Although "...it has to be more of a controlled environment.”.

It would seem that in order to use 3G, you'd need the appropriate chip set. Any chance Apple found a way around that?

I know, I know. Probably not. But I swear, after that last keynote who the frig knows what Apple has accomplished or what might be up their sleeves.

Anyway you look at it, what an exciting time to be a geek.

Hey R2, you're completely right. You have much more patience than I would in the face of all this ignorance.

R2, that iPhone has one fsking MUTHA/HUMPSTER chipset!

We all need to take a step back here for a moment.

The iPhone is in it's infancy. It took 2 1/2 years to bring it out into the public. Apple is being couscous with by controlling the software and functions. They are only aiming for 1% market share for 2008. This is a new market for Apple even though the iPhone has iPod functions. They don't want to mess this up. I believe if demand becomes high for 3G Apple will add the capability. I think Cingular should be up front with Apple about customer numbers using 3G on PDAs and phones. I'm guessing most of them are business enterprise customers who connect them to laptops or use 3G enabled PC cards anyway. Not really for entertainment purposes.

Apple wants you to buy video from the iTunes store and not stream it from a Cingular video service. It's also possible Apple is not ready for customers to download iTunes content direct to phone yet which would require 3G. Maybe they will enable it when that piece is worked out.

Apple wants you to use your MAC to send audio, video and pictures to the phone. That's not a problem for me. In fact I prefer it that way.

I love using my Mac as well!

Give us 3G and Skype-like capabilities, please !!!

OS X ran on Intel chips since version 10.0.

When was the first time the world heard about it?

...5 YEARS LATER!

I support the liklihood that iPhones will be ready to switch to 3G with software updates.

Every single time this happens, people expect less from Apple and the deliver more.

For example: timespan to switch to Intel? Jobs said 1 year. Actual time? 7 months.

Get the picture R2?

>"Umm, maybe because Apple isn't ready to actually use it yet due to issues with Cingular's network??"
>
>Yet Cingiular has many other 3G models working.
>
>The only conceivable possibilities are 1) It's not 3G capable.
>
>2) It is but the software is not ready. given that the phone is vaporware today, what would be the harm >in announcing that when it finally ships it will be 3G upgradable?

I'd say Cingular itself isn't ready, as Cringely said in the article on MDN earlier. Cingular's 3G network uses Real video and not QuickTime (for video-calling), and Steve wants them to use QuickTime because Apple have control over that technology and don't want to have to license a competing technology. With Mpeg-4/H.264 video calling you'd be able to use the iPhone to record, rewind live, and playback later your video calls.

http://www.macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/cringely_apple_iphone/

Let the 6 months of mostly-useless and borderline-nonsensical speculation begin!

How do you make video calls when that lousy 2Mpix camera is on the back of the phone? Or is that also software upgradable to the front?

Software upgradable 3G... what next? GPS was also left out, but it's naturally software upgradable when the deal with Google is ready. Oh please.

3G could have hardware already inside, not turned on for US but possibly turned on for Euro or other markets.

Camera is on back, if they release a version for videochat they could add a camera behind screen (already have such technology patented), perhaps such hardware is already in phone.. though unlikely.

GPS? As far as I understand in the US cell phones already have some form of tracking based on cell towers, so GPS might be redundant in areas with lots of cell towers.. granted, it won't help you pinpoint your position out in the middle of the desert. If you want a "survivalist tool" perhaps you'll have to look elsewhere, but in urban areas tracking is already built in.

There are limitations with version 1.0 of the iPhone as with any version 1 product, but it clearly can be expanded and likely will be before launch.

"Cingular's 3G network uses Real video and not QuickTime (for video-calling),"

The 3G network will transfer any kind of data. The phone could easily be 3G, and if you've seen Cingular's UTMS phones, the browsing, email, music and video speeds and quality are truly impressive compared to Edge phones. The problem with the iPhone is it's a dog which has taken forever by cellphone industry standards to get to market, and in fact is not even shipping yet, and is therefore obsolete before it ships.

But Apple may take note, and fix that issue before it ships.

A Cynic would say that the main reason behind this announcement is to tell people that the iPhone will be overpriced, under-featured, and not coming for some time, so will get those who've been holding off wondering whether to wait for the iPhone or buy a new iPod today to make the decision that the iPhone's not going to do what they need from a cellphone and to buy that new iPod today, not in 6 months time when it ships.