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MDN

Your 'take' is totally hosed......

Apple totally gutted iMovie - I do videos for my kid's basketball and track teams - and school plays... I am NO WHERE near 'professional' work - just movies that look cool and give kids decent memories.

I use video effects, transitions, and other things that iMovie HD provides but iMovie 08 does not.

Get it straight - Apple hosed this one *BIG TIME*....

I tried imovie 08 for the first time last night, so far I don't like it.

MDN, i mostly agree with you, but....

...having given us a product too advanced for what was intended, they can't just pull the rug like that without some bitching.

they should have made a product somewhere between '08 and '06. that would keep the majority happy. '08 is a wonder of usability, but it is too lean on features people have come to depend on for their work.

Come on, MDN, that's ridiculous to defend Apple. Business 101 suggests a company not pull the rug out from under its users and forcefully "reposition" them to a more expensive, more complicated, product. They won't do it. They'll switch companies. Adobe must be so thrilled...

MDN reasoning is beyond me...iMovie too professional? Way, way too far it's original intent? ...SAY'S WHO??? YOU?!

I agree, I never used a video editing program and I picked up iMovie (pre-'08) and learned it quick and had gotten quicker and more proud of the videos I could make; the new iMovie has lost so many of the features I loved and yes, the timeline is very missed! I am a Mac Fan Boy but I must agree that the new iMovie isn't better. I will probably say that maybe a beginner can use it easier - but the average Joe will probably get frustrated and give up before understanding it. I must say export to YouTube is cool!

@ Rory

Don't know what happened there, because AFAIK the installation is supposed to leave your current installation of iMovie 06 untouched.

But you can download iMovie 06 from here:

http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/imovieHD6.html

You know, MDN, I usually agree with your takes, but this sounds like you're a crusty salesperson spinning a negative review. If iMovie was so far ahead or complicated, then Garageband should be gutted down to the same level. I now see iMovie as a giveaway, and the previous version now has to be purchased with Final Cut Express.

MDN: Your take on this is absurd and reeks of fanboyism! The point of the article is to say that if iMovie '08 is the "next generation" of the software then don't arbitrarily just toss all the meaningful features out the window just because the app is re-written from the ground up. It's ridiculous to think that Apple would do this but they did and now they're suffering the backlash they should have expected.

Does this "new" iMovie have it's benefits? Certainly. But it should have those benefits PLUS and the features that made iMovie '06 HD so spectacular.

Lastly, don't give us the line about "it's only a $79 piece of software". If that's the case then everyone using iLife should live in fear b/c then Apple can just rewrite any piece of the software and use that STUPID excuse. What makes iLife so great is that Apple, in their infinite wisdom, make a suite of software so spectacular and offered it at a reasonable price that everyone can afford. That why we love Apple! This move with iMovie takes that love, knocks it down a peg, and starts to put them on part with Microsoft's method of software development. It's Shiite!

Now i know he is an honest reviewer.

MDN

You can't defend the indefensible. Pogue is absolutely correct.

I totally disagree with MDN's take, and 100% agree with Pogue. The logic of thinking that a $15.80 product should be a software weakling escapes me. Even free stuff is often good stuff, so why can't iMovie 08 be as well?

When I first plunged into iMovie 08 I did it without even looking at its features or the tutorial videos. I figured I could just breeze through a new version. Wrong. After a few minutes I thought I had downloaded something from Microsoft... something that was just barely good enough (although the luster told me it really wasn't MS quality stuff).

While I intend to use iMovie 06 where I can and for as long as I can, that too is a disappointment, for one reason. There is a bug that's been present in iMovie 06 for as long as I can remember. When you import a still image it becomes blurry... real blurry. Makes it difficult to use for a lot of the things I want to do with it. So I've been waiting for iMovie 08, thinking surely this bug will be squashed. And then we are given this. Yuk.

I've enjoyed you comments for years but that's changed today. What an absurd statement you've made. Dummying down software for the next generation release is dumbfounding. Maybe Apple should take some features out of the upcoming Leopard software. I mean, it will only be $129 dollars and that $129 doesn't go as far as it did on the release of panther because of inflation. Oh yeah and instead of improving computer lines and lowering the price they should be raising it. This, of course (as with iMovie) is absurd thinking. Keep it up and your credibility is lost.

MDN: Your take is totally off-base and just goes to show that you constantly defend Apple Computer NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO, even when Apple Computer is wrong.

Let's get one thing straight here, MDN: YOU ARE TOTALLY WRONG, and DAVID POGUE IS 100% RIGHT.

We have been creating movies for years in iMovie and have come to DEPEND on this application -- Apple has now suddenly made us **UNABLE TO PERFORM THE VERY FUNCTIONS THAT WE HAVE BEEN DOING FOR YEARS** by ditching iMovie altogether and coming up with something horrible in its place.

WHAT THE F**K IS APPLE THINKING HERE?! APPLE HAS TOTALLY AND 100% F**KED US OVER WITH THE RELEASE OF IMOVIE '08, and for MacDailyNews to SUPPORT Apple's decision to F**K OVER ITS CUSTOMERS JUST GOES TO SHOW THAT MacDailyNews is run by a bunch of high school kids with nothing better to do than cheer on Apple no matter what they do. If Apple does it, Apple must be right and everyone else must be wrong. That's total bullshit, MacDailyNews.

You can't just abandon your entire user base by canceling a product that was being used to create excellent projects in the past.

We will make damn sure that nobody we know upgrades to iLife '08.

And MacDailyNews, you guys should have your heads examined.

Oh yeah, one more thing.....

Pogue is probably THE BEST Writer out there from a 'pro-apple' stance....

yet he is not afraid to call a 'spade a spade'....

MDN - you otta try it sometime - the whole "Journalistic integrity" thing.

I actually like the new iMovie. I've already posted a movie to YouTube and a movie to my .Mac. Way easier. While small, there was indeed a learning curve to iMovie HD 6. There should be no learning curve for iLife products.

MDN? What happened to you? Even I have trouble defending Apple on this one. Losing 'THEMES'? That feature alone helped me sell the Mac to friends! Losing the audio/fx? Chapters (after all, it is supposed to work with iDVD)?

Folks, Apple obviously realized their mistake when they offered iMovie 6 HD for free download.

What a bummer. I would guess that Apple will be adding in most items missed in this version and hopefully be adding back an option for timeline viewing.

Nah guys imovie 5 is cools etc


BUT
stop giving it away,charge a propper fin amount for it say 199.

or 59 for just Imovie

this 79 is a crap

Wow, MDN is sooo wrong here. It is possible for Apple to screw up. I will not be "upgrading" to iMovie 08, that is for sure.

I don't have a Video Camera, my video is limited to stuff I can record on a phone or on my still camera, even if I did have one, I wouldn't be wanting to create anything to in depth. iMovieHD was very good but previously I could never really be bothered with it as it was too involved and took too long to do. This new iMovie is great, it's easy and fast. Even exporting seems quick. I'm not concerned about how far through I am since I'm only going to be doing something minutes long anyway.

This is not to say that an app between this and Final Cut, more like the old iMovie wouldn't fill a niche, but not at the price of iLife. If they spruced up iMovie HD, added in the best of the new iMovie and sold it for $79 (or more) on it's own then I think it would make more sense.

"iMovie shouldn't be about doing any level of "professional" work. Apple had gotten iMovie way, way too far ahead of its original intent."

Are you freaking kidding me? I want to do simple screencasts/podcasts, iMovie did that really well. The new version doesn't allow me to do that at all, so I should buy a "Pro" tool? Yeah, ok. You're missing the entire middle of the market MDN.

I agree with Shen.

This is almost Machiavellian. This sort of thing would easily be interpreted as baiting (for Final Cut Express) had it been any other company's behaviour. After all, iMovie must have been cannibalizing FCE sales.

I actually think that this was just an honest miss. The new iMovie seemed so "revolutionary" in terms of ease of use and speed, that the functionality of the previous version wasn't impressive enough for Jobs anymore.

Not a big user of iMovie but when I did it was pretty tricky to master. What Jobs demo'd looked pretty darn clever to me.

Why is selecting clips, dragging and dropping such a problem?

Is the timeline really so crucial? After all this isn't for a live TV studio environment is it?

Somewhat of an over reaction to this is my thinking, and I am tempted to use iMovie more now than was before.

MDN, things to keep in mind:

1) iMovie 6 was a basic editing package. All the more impressive that professionals were also able to use it.

2) Probably cost Apple a lot more to rebuild an entirely new iMovie than enhance the previous version so the $15.80 feature just doesn't fly.

3) iLife is a big selling feature. Themes were brilliant. Crippling one of the most impressive, easy to use and important apps was a mistake. Even Apple recognized it by releasing iMovie 6 HD. Because they released iMovie 6 HD so fast after the launch of iLife 8, it is apparent Apple realized possible issues prior to the launch of iLife 08. It also most likely speaks volumes that Apple will be adding enhancements to the new iMovie enabling it to surpass iMovie 6 in terms of use.

I don't see what the big fuss is about. If you have a previous version of iMovie, continue to use it. But if you're new to the platform, the previous functions won't be missed because it's something the individual would have never used anyway. So, if this new person who just bought a new Mac with the new iMovie and wants something more powerful than drag and drop, then that person can buy something more robust from Apple. Sounds to me like a good way to make more money for Apple because they can up-sell their Express product.

But if what Pogue says is true, that does kind of suck to not know how long your movie is considering that sites like YouTube are now imposing time limits and what is uploaded.

Why should I upgrade to a downgrade? I was looking forward to an update to iMovie 6 HD, but I got hosed by Apple. iMovie 08 is a total step backward

MDN, your take on iMovie 8 might be the worst I have ever seen from you fanboys, and that's saying a lot. Give it a rest.

P.S. This coming from someone who has spent thousands of dollars on Apple gear the last 10 years.

MW: "small" as in your credibility. Maybe you have been reduced to trolling for hits, ala Dvorak.

yeah yeah, OK geee , But also How are mac minis,

Thy are awesome, can apple charge less for them though I recon 499 and 599 and don't put on ilife

MDN: Quit defending Apple on everything they do. You just lose your credability. No company is perfect, and Apple isn't any different. Imovie in it's current incarnation is a step backwards, an after-thought even. I'm not sure what they were doing for almost two years. I'd say that most of them were probably working on the iphone or Apple tv.

Chiming in with most of the others. I really do no care for the new Movie. Was hoping for improvements and new features and more stability with the same look and feel as '06. When I opened it for the first time I was stunned. Yeah - it's easy to use - but seems limited. I do mostly home movie stuff and even I needed two channels of audio. Also had a lot of Gee Three plugins. I think Apple needs to rethink what they have wrought here.

Pogue is right. MDN is wrong.

This pretty much illustrates the depths to which MDN's editors have sunk. This USED to be a pretty good forum, but with MDN's recent "Takes" becoming more blind and rabid, it's been attracting a lot of knuckle-dragging mouth-breathers who couldn't rub two rational sentences together. And they have the nerve to trot out Enderle, Thurrott, and Dvorak as trolls. Recently, MDN has not been much better than these three idiots.

This comment thread demonstrates to me that the kind of folks who used to make this a great site haven't gone away; they're pretty much just drowned out by the idiots. It is wonderfully refreshing to see that there are still interesting, independent-minded Mac fans out there. Thanks all of you.

I'm back with another scathing comment intended for MDN's support and reasoning of iMovie 08.

First, my background. I was a TA @ Stanford University. Subject: iLife 06. After that I worked for Apple retail as a Creative Genius.
On a more personal level, I almost exclusively use Final Cut Pro - very, very rarely do I use iMovie (as it is not intended for Professional use).

Given my background, I think I can talk and draw from expierence and with it give MDN a credible smackdown.

1) In the years following iMovie 1, one thing was very obvious, Apple's intent was to give the casual event video enthusiast a program that is easy to use, but will yield very, very good looking results. The years have given us just that.

2) While @ Apple, I would start people off on iMovie and over time some would and some wouldn't move to Apple's flagship NLE Pro or Express system. However, making that transition from iMovie to FCE or FCP was a fairly easy one. Much of the editing jargon used in iMovie 6 exists in the Pro NLE (Non Linear Editing system)

3)This program I've recommended to hundreds of Switchers...Some who are new to NLE and were dead tired of battling Windows Movie or any other windows NLE program for that matter. Case in Point, about a Month ago, a weekend event warrior, who shoots weddings, birthday parties, etc has been on a Tape based editing suite for nearly 20 years! He's attempted in the past to make that move into computer based editing in the windows world. Only to find himself back @ his old way of editing video features. He saw my MBP and I introduced him to iMovie -- mind you he is NOT savvy and FCP would have killed any chance of him buying a Mac -- upon seeing how iMovie 06 works and end result he was thrown back! He absolutely loved the "flexibility" and ease of use, for which only iMovie can do. Final Cut Express and Pro are simply too daunting for A) a computer newby B) PC to Mac switcher and C) someone who wants a "semi-pro" look with child like UI.

to be continued....

Andrew , thing then comment again .

please

if you need filters to spice up your movies then your content sux big time.

MDN is NOT doing a service to the Mac community with its excuses and justifications for an inferior application.

Articles like Pogue's WILL get Apple to listen and improve the product to where it should have been in the first place. If everybody thought like the MDN "take", we'd have to live with this mediocrity indefinitely.

I only use iMove for capturing since it is more stable than FCP. If I cannot capture my video and drop it in FCP, than I will be pissed too.

MDN is right, professionals hate iMovie.

.. think

And let's remember, Steve said that they had created an app that will "move it to a whole different level". (Not an exact quote but close enough.)

Now, if I'm editing together a holiday video, which I did a couple of days ago, and want to add a song to it, shouldn't I be able to fade the freaking song out as the picture goes to black?!

If I'm not severely mistaken, this cannot be done in iMovie 08. Now if MDN is implying that this is a feature only for pro apps, then they are so far off on this subject that I truly believe that they should get their heads examined.

All this said, I've never created a decent looking movie of a two week trip as fast as I did with iMovie 08, so it's not all bad. But to drop some crazily basic features is just plain weird.

Pogue is spot on. MDN's take is absolute crap.

Spell check, then comment again.....

Pretty please.

MDN, you are going to look like total dills as Apple adds those missing features back in.

Why do you think the installer leaves the previous version on your Mac? Why do you think Apple immediately offered iMovie HD for download?

And it ain't because iMovie 08 doesn't run on G4s. It's because heaps of people need more power than iMovie 08, but don't want to spend hundreds on FCE.

I agree that iMovie needed an overhaul to make it more user-friendly but it didn't need neutering.

usually i agree with the "take" but this is just being an apple apologist to the Nth degree. you cant fault people for using the functions that were built in that have now been stripped.

i bought a camcorder because i wanted to use imovie (2 years ago) if this was the version of imovie out then, im sure i wouldnt have

This is one of those times when MDN looks like a bunch of blind, hapless lemmings. I used iMovie for years to make HOME MOVIES, and I hate the new version. iMovie 06 was still WAY simpler than Final Cut Express (which I hated when I attempted to use it).

The whole business model argument has some merit, but Apple went about this all wrong. This new iMovie should be a whole new program... it's dishonest to give it the same name. They should call it Fisher Price My First Movie, and then sell iMovie (with continued development) separately – heck, I'd pay $79 for it alone.

But for MDN to actually argue that this was a good move is so lame. It pretty much taints your credibility on every other story.

MDN has lost me on this one. So just because you pay $15 you should expect crap?

I might add that iMovie 08 should have been named iMovie Lite.

It *is* simpler then iMovie 6. But WTF!? You can't 'update' an application and give it significantly LESS features.

Apple missed the boat on this one.

The change in design will make it easier to edit on the iphone down the line. It's coming.

MDN are you people serious i am also a apple fanboy, but i agree with pogue on imovies i bought iLife the day it was announced but seriously apple has take step backward. to edit my home movies also i used all the functions and it resulted in a very good movie. seriously guys apple fucked up the iMovie 08

That was quite possibly the most ridiculous take on a story I've ever read.

It would be one thing to remove features that nobody was using, but to take away POPULAR features from what was a killer app is a scam.

It's like this, if you think you are doing film editing, you need Final Cut Studio. iMovie '08 does exactly what it should be doing. Any editor that had a clue would hit the limitations of the old iMovie in about 2 minutes. iMovie '08 is for creating quick home movie compilations and it does it very well. I am amazed at the speed in which '08 can sling around HD. Pogue got it wrong. iMovie is not for professionals, it's for your mother or your wife or your kids. I'm even inspired to pull out all of my minidv tapes that I have been dreading to edit. '08 is not perfect, it will get better. Keep up the good work Steve.