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One thing everybody seems to be forgetting - when they say the new version of iMovie is supposed to be better for beginners and low end users - are the outrageous system requirements: far more than anything else in the iLife suite, and even worse than Final Cut!

Also, MDN's take - that iMovie shouldn't be as powerful as it was beacuase it was too cheap - conveniently forgets the fact that iLife sells Macs, not just itself. Indeed, iMovie was probably the single biggest source of switchers of any Mac software.

Maybe Apple should have put both versions of iMovie in iLife '08. They could have slightly upgraded iMovie HD and then added this new "dumbed down" version too. They could have called the new version iMovie Express for the Amateur users. Maybe that would have appeased all the irate iMovie HD users.

I doubt iMovie was a source of switchers. I don not know anybody who uses it. People here tend to forget that simple truth - most Mac users don't use iMovie/Garageband/iWeb - because they have no reason to. The only one everybody uses is iPhoto.

iM 08's handling of hi-def is little short of amazing, and I'd guess that's why it needs so much oomph.

There was no reason to dumb-down iMovie. It's just a greedy ploy by Apple to sell more copies of Final Cut. iMovie has now become a totally amateur application for creating lame-assed amateur videos. Apple has sold out it's iMovie user-base. If MS did something like this everyone here would be laughing at their greed and incompetence.

iMovie 08 seems to demonstrated that, "Apple is the new Microsoft."Can anyone think of other examples of how Apple is morphing into Microsoft 2.0?

Benjamin Lachkar:
"I doubt iMovie was a source of switchers. I don not know anybody who uses it. People here tend to forget that simple truth - most Mac users don't use iMovie/Garageband/iWeb - because they have no reason to. The only one everybody uses is iPhoto."

imho- iMovie was/is one of the biggest draws in the iLife package and the reason I upgrade iLife. When I show people what iMovie can do and so easily, it has caused people to change platforms. My brother was a PC head (very stubborn... "I'm not gonna get a Mac!" now has a 20" iMac. His sons have a G4 Ibook and a Macbook so they can create movies of the vacation which they're enjoying at this moment

Oops...! demonstrate

I sense a troll alert all over this iMovie thing.

With all the hysterical ranting and raving about iMovie, it appears that Apple probably should have had both versions together with the ability to switch between the quick version and the more advanced. I would imagine they are trying to simplify things in general to make it easier for people possibly switching to the Mac. But it appears they may have made a miscalculation on this. Maybe they will rethink this situation. Personally, I've never used iMovie or owned a video camera. But after seeing the demos of the new version, I am tempted to get into video. Yeah, I know, that's not a logical reason to do so. I can be gullible when it comes to technology.

@ Benjamin Lachkar
"I doubt iMovie was a source of switchers."

Go check out the discussion boards for iMovie. You'll find that there are hundreds of switchers that are pretty pissed off.

Re: iMovie

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

I've never used iMovie, but I'm tempted to use the new version because it sounds easy. Apple probably plans to add back many of the missing editing features. This may have just been an innovative new app that Steve was excited to share and it's not fully baked. Remember OS X 10.0? It was definitely not ready for prime time.
Frankly, I'm a little tired of all the ignorant whining by former iMovie users. You can still use the old version and you DON'T know that the new version won't improve. Give Apple a chance! Ever heard of waiting until all the evidence comes in before jumping to conclusions? Guess not. You must either be the products of a poor education, or just jerks. Well, which is it?

Luke: "There was no reason to dumb-down iMovie. It's just a greedy ploy by Apple to sell more copies of Final Cut. iMovie has now become a totally amateur application for creating lame-assed amateur videos. Apple has sold out it's iMovie user-base. If MS did something like this everyone here would be laughing at their greed and incompetence."

Umm, is that why they're allowing people to download iMovie HD FOR FREE - so they can sell more copies of Final Cut? Yeah...that makes about as much sense as a bull with tits.

Hey you won't hear me bitch. I have my cake and eat it too, iMovie'08 for fast & casual edits, and '06 when I want/need to be more serious. Win Win!
I does seem a sensible concept to have just included both to begin with, perhaps with a more "mass market/amateur" name for '08.

I have to disagree with all this iMovie stuff, I switched last year, I am not a power user in any fashion.

I tried using iMovie 06, and it was over my head, I did not really need it, so I gave up on it.

iMovie 08 is a breeze to use, and is fantastic for idiots like me (90% of computer users)

as some here posted, maybe they should have bundled iLife with both versions under 2 names, but I love iMovie 08!!

LorD 1776 - from, "not jerks, ASSHOLES" to "Apple probably should have had both versions together with the ability to switch between the quick version and the more advanced". Nice switch.
Jake - "This may have just been an innovative new app that Steve was excited to share and it's not fully baked. Remember OS X 10.0?"? The original OSX was entirely new software, with a brand new name ... NOT a revision of a program with major history behind it.
Me - iMovie'08 was a mistake. Maybe iMovie HD was one, too, and the one before that. iMovie'08 is a mistake because it removes several features that users have been relying on for YEARS! Who thought it was a good idea to remove the TimeLine??? Whoever it was, they weren't a video editor. Or even an AUDIO editor. As for the earlier versions being "mistakes", they may have led us to expect way too much of this modest software. Would we be half as upset if our expectations were much lower? If the earlier versions were little more than "shareware slice&splice;editors"? I doubt it.
iMovie HD was in the tradition of earlier iMovie efforts - good enough a consumer could produce a real MOVIE if they had the time and energy to put into it. And, I guess, if their technical needs were modest.
So.
Time to switch subjects. This one has been beaten to death.
Dave

I was once a beginner with iMovie having no experience with video editing. I had absolutely no problem learning it quickly. Is iMovie 08 dumbed down for all those stupid enough to have used Windows all of these years who have finally switched? That's the only thing that makes sense to me.

iMovie was never powerful enough for my modest home user needs, so I have always used Final Cut and StudioPro.

However, I am single and have a good income, so this latest news bothers me. iMovie IS a source of swithers, even if noone uses it (which I don't agree with) because it has always received soooo much good press, free advertising - you know like "There is nothing like this in the windows world for under $X".

"swithers"...interesting...

I agree with Benjamin Lachkar's comments.

Most PC switchers did not use iLife programs, except for iPhoto (and iTunes which is technically not part of iLife anymore). The new iMovie is Apple's move to make it as simple to use as iPhoto. It's still not as simple as iPhoto, but I think more novices will start using it. As more people start using video cameras, and still photo cameras that take video, this move makes absolute sense in terms of helping to sell more Macs to switchers.

As users get more advanced, some will migrate to Final Cut Express (or even Pro), which Apple sells separately. It's a great business decision; get more customers involved in an activity and then sell them the "pro" version of the software. I think some people forget that Apple is a for-profit business with business strategies. It's not a non-profit organization.

I switched to the Mac platform in 2001. The main software reason drawing me to the Mac was the initial iMovie app. As iPhoto and iDVD were released to complement iTunes and iMovie my decision to migrate to the Mac was even more justified. I bought the first version of Final Cut Express and then FCE v.3.0 and have still never used them! iMovie just kept getting better and good enough for my needs. I'm glad to hear that one will have the option of using both versions of iMovie, HD & '08.

Just a couple of points, I understand the frustration of current iMovie users, but the reality is that it would have been much easier for Apple to upgrade the existing one than create a new one from the ground up. They did this for a reason, to make it easier and faster to put together a simple movie from your camcorder. As far as I can see this is the outcome.

For existing users who are used to the other features, remember, you haven't lost anything. You don't have to upgrade. If you do its not that expensive and you do have the added bonus of very quickly throwing together a video with the new imovie 08. I use Final Cut Pro, but like the look of iMovie 08 for doing simple and more importantly, very fast editing for less important work!

Whatever your gripes, I don't think Apple are doing this on purpose to see Final Cut Express, but to make it as fast and easy for beginners to make movies! That's the market their in and they want to remain competitive, or way ahead of the competition!

Panny,

Yes, we still have iMovie HD. The critical question is will Apple continue to support and develop it?

I don't get all the complaints.

iMovie 08 seems to me far nicer than the 06 version. It's so much faster than before, requires no rendering, and makes it possible to throw a movie together super quickly.

iMovie 06 was far clumsier. Themes? Useless. Audio mixing? Use GarageBands movie track features - they are far better than the audio controls in iMovie 06 anyway. And, it IS possible to cut edit and scrub clips far easier than the old version.

Lee,

I AGREE 100% WITH YOU... I am one of those PC users that switched to the Mac, because of iMovie '06. It's a great program and I really love its features.

HOWEVER, the new iMovie '08 is a piece of trash that has virtually zero features. For those that happened to have been given the gift of being born with a brain, iMovie '06 was not hard to use. It was very easy, especially if you watched Apple's FREE, online training videos.

Unfortunately, the new version looks more like an Hefty garbage bag commercial: WIMPY, WIMPY, WIMPY

I know of several Mac sales that I am planning on canning here soon from friends and family that were getting ready to buy the new iMac. No, they now need a PC instead.

@ Bryon

For the love of God, don't can any mac sales.

iMovieHD '06 is available for free download, I believe. Unless that is only for users who purchased iLife, as opposed to it being pre-installed on the new iMacs. Can someone confirm?

Is iMovie 08 dumbed down for all those stupid enough to have used Windows all of these years who have finally switched? That's the only thing that makes sense to me.

Ding, ding ding! Plus, there was no more room to grow iMovie without cutting into sales of Final Cut Express.

You said, "Apple has sold out it's iMovie user-base. If MS did something like this everyone here would be laughing at their greed and incompetence."

MS does that all the time. Remember when Vista was going to have all those great features so you should wait to buy it instead of Mac OS or Linux??? Then all the main features disappeard and you were left with tons of DMR.

Yep, its MS troll season, all right. They are really coming out of the wood work. Maybe when the new Zunes come out that will make them happy.

PS. speaking of Zunes, did MS ever proclaim their 1 millionth sold????

en

'I doubt iMovie was a source of switchers. I don not know anybody who uses it.'

What are you smoking? Damn near every independent film maker I know uses iMovie for rough editing, and bought Macs for this purpose. I have friends who use it to create content for their web sites and blogs, and again, they got Macs for this reason. I am acquainted with many parents, both tech savvy and otherwise who use it to make their home movies. I think
Apple is banking just a wee bit too heavily on the iPod/MySpace generation, and the cool veneer they currently have going for them. I agree that the new version should have been an entirely new app, an addition to iLife that added value to the package. I can't blame them for wanting to strike while the iron is hot, but come on! This is all beginning to get ridiculous.

I don't get why everyone is so upset about iMovie. You can still use the previous version so you don't really lose anything.

IMO iMovie '08 is a great upgrade, it is targeted perfectly for a home user. I thought iMovie alone was super easy to use. And honestly I have put off doing some home movies because it became cumbersome. I have never been able to throw together a home movie any quicker or easier. And GUESS WHAT. When the video is done it looks no worse than the other movies made from previous versions.

If there is anything I am bothered by the new iMovie it's the sys req. They are quite demanding. A Powerbook a couple years old is excluded. That is too recent.

If you have trouble using iMovie '06, then I suggest that you buy a copy of "The Macintosh iLife '06" by Jim Heid from Peachpit Press. It's has lots of pictures and it's easy to comprehend.

Extra! Extra!

Steve's little new toy, the iPhone, took so many resources away from all Apple projects, the development of iMovie '08 was trown at the last minute at an unfortunate Engineer returning from a vacation.

Far fetched you say? Maybe, but remember iLife traditionally shipped in January, a full 8 months behind schedule. Above all Leopard will ship a full 4-6 months late.

Apple is increasingly and dangerously out of touch with its customer base. iMovie '08 has brought it out loud and clear.

Bad Apple. Bad, bad Apple.