HardMac (MacBidouille in English) contacted their sources “to get information regarding the reason behind the non-evolving Mac mini and three answers were provided,” Lionel reports for HardMac.
• Apple does not like this model, as it was designed under the pressure of shareholders willing to get a cheap entry level Mac hardware.
• A Core 2 Duo-based Mac mini would compete with iMac and MacBook, models for which Apple has larger margins or sale volumes.
• Last answer is probably the most interesting one: a Core 2 Duo Mac mini would kill Apple TV. Indeed, if the minimal GUI of the Apple TV makes it user-friendly and a perfect device for just watching movies, it can not compete with the Mac mini for any further functions, and many Mac users have already chosen the Mac mini to be plugged to their TV even thought it is twice more expensive. If this is true, one will have to expect the Apple TV to become a real business success in order to see the Mac mini being upgraded.
Lionel reports, “Last but not least, R&D resources might have been so much dedicated to the iPhone and Leopard (beside iMac and MacBook revision to come), that Apple could not work on a Core 2 Duo Mac mini and decided to wait for Santa Rosa to bring a Mac mini based on the last Intel mobile platform evolution, together with the new iMac and MacBook models.”
More in the full article here.
[Thanks to MacDailyNews Reader “LinuxGuy and Mac Prodigal Son” for the heads up.]
If they’re just going to let it languish, then just kill it off. I think that would be a big mistake, but there is no sense in letting it just sit there and rot.
Well, that’s a fine how do you do…..
I’m not suprised by this news, although it’s rather straightforward to turn the mac mini into a 64 bit workstation yourself, just exchange the cpu. I’m planning to just that very soon, just like I exchanged the HDU after 2 weeks to 160 GB.
It will void your warranty though.
I hope it is the last, “R & D resources”
I am waiting for the mini, with 811n
A lack of resources??? C’mon, these guys have billions in cash and can staff up in no time if they desired!
Apple shouldn’t be so protective of the iMac. It’s a great machine. People who want an all in one will still buy it.
I love my mini, it’s a great second complimentary computer to my iMac. The price is it’s best point of course, so you can’t expect it to compete specs wise with the rest of the line-up.
I also know 2 switchers who took the plunge with the mini (toes testing the water first while using XP) both now have iMacs!
Apple don’t drop the mini!
Yeah, the mini certainly needs a refresh. it also needs a decent graphics card instead of the integrated chip it now uses.
Apple STILL needs a mid-range machine with 2 PCI slots (one for a good graphics card) and 4 RAM slots to fill the gaping VOID between the Mac mini and the Mac Pro. It’s logical and they’d sell a ton of them.
I know quite few people who would LOVE this kind of machine!
I don’t buy any of the first three reasons. I think it is the last. Why waste R&D on a minor upgrade when better processors are coming? I’m waiting, and waiting and will probably get a mini this summer, upgrade or no upgrade.
Hard Mac???
That’s one helluva gay site name. Some guy called Francois done up like the biker off Village People fondling his mighty mouse and trying to look hard.
I know I opted for a Mac Mini over AppleTV. OSX looks great in 1080p.
I’ll stay with my G4 Mini and just keep waiting for Penryn models, then.
For something hanging off of an HDTV, the G4 is still quite usable. I still have and use a 550 MHz TiBook, FFS.
With Ubuntu Linux getting better, my need for OS X is dwindling. I hope Apple devotes some resources to it’s core business, and less to the iPhone.
The other killer for the Mini becoming a success is future sales – with the iMac you purchase a screen, keyboard & mouse (plus more features) every few years, whereas Apple only get a cheap box for a new Mini.
Solution: add a PCI slot to the iMac and remove the wireless bluetooth/WiFi from the Mini.
Otherwise drive the prosumer market and create a Mini Pro which is an AppleTV with Mac mode, large drive, 802.11n, HDMI out, digital TV receiver and a BluRay drive for DVDs. This would kill the last of the remaining Media Players.
To crack the enterprise, Apple still need a cheap secretarial WP machine and the Mini is great for that.
This is from a Hardmac.com test of switching processors on a mini to Core 2 Duo. (http://www.hardmac.com/articles/69/page5/)
“- The Core Solo did not surpass 59 degrees and dissipated a maximum of 12.8W.
– The Core Duo did not surpass 70 degrees and dissipated a maximum of 16.2W.
– The Two Core 2 Duos attained the same maximum temperature, 92 degrees, and both of them consumed a little less than 30W.”
After playing with the fan speed, they managed to lower the temperature to 80 (having though increased the noise)
I am sure Apple’s engineers can work things out, but what they really must aim for is a system that behaves like a reliable, stable and quite Mac…
I disagree…I was in an college IT department in Atlanta recently and they were bench testing a mini. Apparantly they have a large amount of keyboards and monitors around the campus. The IT managers logic was why buy 2 computers in a split windows/Mac environment. One computer that would run either was the solution in a cost sensitive situation where all they needed was a CPU for an upgrade. Plus the small form factor of the mini was ideal…I was impressed with the thought he had put into the college’s needs and not sticking with the standard PC formula. My windows centric assistant that was with me was impressed as well. Just my 2 cents..Pete
There should be a non-iMac model between Mac mini and Mac Pro … and its name should be Mac.
Mr. Reeee,
please allow meeee to introduce myself, and then you’ll know yet another one.
I’ve been waiting for about ten years for a ‘regular’ computer from Apple, and bought the mini just as a stand-over.
Still waiting …..
ah the Mini. It’s been my AppleTV for about a year now. I can’t see a thing the AppleTV does that my Mini didn’t do a year ago, and it is so happy working for me it doesn’t have the slightest idea that it is growing old and in need of a refresh.
Like the G4 Cube, the Mini will fall by the wayside. Great idea, good little machine, but with AppleTV being one of the future ideas of Apple…there simply won’t be as big a market for Mini’s.
You know they’re going to upgrade the AppleTV to death, so it’s practically going to be a Mini anyway. The future is in your living room…not your desk.
I actually agree with United States of Generica
There should be a non-iMac model between Mac mini and Mac Pro … and its name should be Mac.
Can’t lose the Mini – can’t let it wallow in the mire either – it is a great box and I think Apple needs to have a low end Mac available for beginners and those who have a nice monitor hanging around. That said… I think they should try and give us some more power in the Mini. Make it a little bigger… but don’t let it go!
I hope Apple doesn’t kill the Mac Mini. Mine is working perfectly for my needs. I have it running in the basement without a monitor, keyboard, or mouse and it wirelessly streams iTunes and iPhoto to both of my Apple TVs. I set it up remotely using Chicken Of The VNC. This setup allows us to watch movies and TV shows, or to listen to music at each of the Apple TVs. It also allows us to watch or listen on any Mac using Front Row. Everybody in the house watches or listens to whatever they want, whenever they want.
Since the Intel switch, and even more since the upgrade of the iMac to C2D, the Mini has become a lousy bargain, compared to the iMac: 2.5″ harddrive, no iSight, no keyboard, no mouse, and a slower processor, too, compared with the entry level iMac. No bright, gorgeous TFT display, either.
For the consumer, buying an iMac is a no-brainer.
The Mini needs a revamp, slightly taller enclosure, user accessible RAM slots and drive bay for 3.5 ” hard drives.
The Mini switched me from Windows to Mac like thousands of others. I purchased two, the original and then the latest. Along the way I bought three iPods, A 20″ ACD, and wireless keyboard and mouse. I never would have sent that much money to Apple if not for the Mini. And, I am not alone. If His Steveness retires the Mini, he should go along with it.
Wouldn’t buy an TV but would buy a mini in a flash if they gave it more guts. And yes, I’d connect it to small flat screen and use it as a media server.
MadMac: “A lack of resources??? C’mon, these guys have billions in cash and can staff up in no time if they desired!”
Ah, the Microsoft approach…
You know, hiring software engineers from a bunch of recent college grads with no experience is no more effective than hiring 100 monkeys and letting them randomly bang on keyboards.
Smart employers do not hire based on body counts, but on skill levels and experience… I for one ignore college degrees when reviewing candidates (I hire CG modelers, animators and artists), as in my experience, recent college grads are universally self-indulgent, arrogant morons who can’t wipe their asses properly without assistance.
There is NO substitute for experience, and hiring more inexperienced people is worse than hiring few experienced people.
I would be very sad if they abandoned the mini. An after school program I volunteer at just bought 5 of them. They are perfect. They also got a shelf that is mounted under the table with the mini’s locked in with a padlock. The previous computers (standard tower PC’s running Linux) worked okay, but the kids kept kicking them. The hardest part of keeping them running was just keeping them physicall working. The mini’s have been mounted out of the way and have been working perfectly for over two months now. The program didn’t have enough money for iMac’s and they already had a lot of donated CRT’s, so the mini was the perfect solution.
I like to have a new computer every three or four years but I think it is wasteful to replace a large LCD panel at the same rate (one has no choice with an iMac). A good 20in LCD can last as least twice as long. There for, I need a mid-range headless Mac. Where is that your Steveness? I’m still waiting.
US of G, didn’t I say exactly that last week? Even gave it a price range – $1,200 to $2,000. Have since reconsidered the top end … $1,500 would better isolate it from the Mac Pro yet still give it room for two models.
Featuring easy access to:
A spare Drive Bay
Two card slots
Four RAM slots
Fans for the single Core2Duo
etc.
Modest, but more than iMac or Mac mini.
DLMeyer – the Voice of G.L.Horton’s Stage Page Pod Cast
When will we gain the ability to edit our posts? I missed a point!
The TV and the Mac mini should be merged, at the bottom of the line. It isn’t like they are that different, the TV has the same form factor but a bit less content than the mini is all. A few minor tweaks and the three models become a “line”.
I would buy in a heartbeat a $999 Mac mini with Blu-ray. I will never buy an AppleTV until Apple is selling 1080p content over iTunes, which might never happen. If you care about HD quality for your movie watching, then a Mac mini with Blu-ray is the only way to go.
Write to Apple telling them to make this.
I think it would be stupid and short sighted to let the mini either die or languish. Apple needs the minis to lure people away from consumer windows peecees, like Dell and the like. Apple needs to upgrade the minis for the same price or drop the price on the current configurations.
There’s still a price difference between the Mini’s and desktop systems from Dell and the like. Dell’s site has a dimension e520 desktop with a 20″ widescreen monitor, 1.82 C2D, 250 gig hd, superdrive, vista home premium and 2gig of memory for $829.00.
Say my parents want to buy a computer. I would have a heck of a time getting them to buy a mini when they can spend as little as $30 bucks more to get a 3-4x bigger hard drive, 4x the memory, dedicated graphics card and 20″ widescreen monitor.
Yes, the mini is a cool design, and OSX is infinitely more secure than XP or Vista. But my folks, and a lot of other consumers, will shy away from the Macs and think that comparitively, they’re getting ripped off. Design and the OS is what’s growing the marketshare, but being a little more competitive price wise on the consumer models would greatly help. Either that, or Apple should have people going door to door handing out pamphlets and tracts.
I’d be thrilled if Apple would just bump up the iTunes movies to 720p. (1080p would be silly given typical download speeds.)
I’d like to see the Mac Mini go away, and instead see a smaller (and less expensive) version of the iMac become available.
One reason I don’t have a soft spot in my heart for the mini is that our chief engineer keeps trying to make FCP editing work stations out of them, and then gets all bent out of shape because his little Mac Minis don’t run Motion and DVD Studio as well as our Dual G5s and multi-core Intels. …You would think he’d get it, but he doesn’t. I have been trying to get some of our more specialized editing staff to get it through their collective heads that the Mac Mini if for grandma and grandpa, not for professional application – period. Just ’cause it can run the pro apps in no way implies that it should.
For that matter, I think even grandma and grandpa should be using the latest, lower cost, iMac 15″ instead of a mini. The mini is just an odd bird in the Mac line up.
P.S.
The 15″ iMac if refer to above has not yet been designed as far as I know.
I recently gave Apple some feedback on http://www.apple.com/feedback about updating the Mac mini soon! Here is what I wrote:
_________________________________________________
For your feedback: I am deciding to purchase a Mac mini over an Apple TV. To qualify as an entertainment computer in my home (5th Mac) I wish for five extra features over an Apple TV. 1. Playback Keynote presentations. 2. Playback media files with Quicktime Player without the need to input them into iTunes. 3. Play web content (Safari) and other Macintosh apps. 4. Playback DVD disks because Apple’s DVD Player can infinitely scale content to fit my 720p HDTV the way I wish to view it. 5. Use the computer as a PVR (DVR) for recording TV shows (I have already purchased Elgato’s EyeTV Hybrid).
I don’t mind needing to use Apple’s wireless keyboard and mouse to accomplish these things. I can still use the FrontRow remote for iPhoto, iTunes, etc. The keyboard would be easier to use, however, if Apple to releases a wireless keyboard that had a built-in trackpad, like MacBooks have; so the keyboard could sit on your lap on your livingroom couch; thus eliminating the mouse.
Temporarily, I use my Powerbook G4 17″ 1.67GHz as my entertainment Mac, until I purchase the Mac mini. For instance, we have friends and family over, using Safari to surf, Google or Wikipedia questions about things that we bring up in conversations, etc. Laughing at pictures and videos we find on the Internet. We all share the large HGTV screen in our living room for these purposes. It is a new form of socializing and sharing news and information web sites in the living room. A “think different” form of entertainment. YouTube and other Internet sites are fun to explore with a small group of friends or family. The high-definition of flat screen HDTVs make this all possible (1280×720 pixels or higher).
I was ready to purchase a Mac mini in November 2006; but I thought I should wait till January MacExpo for anouncements of a speed bump (Core2Duo), better internal graphics, 802.11n wireless network card, come stock with 1 GB RAM and possibly be loaded with Leopard and iLife07. Obviously, I am still waiting for some of the above features (April 22, 2007). I would be very mad, after waiting this long, to spring for the current Mac mini model and find out that a few weeks later, some of these features are then released. I cannot wait for October to purchase, I must purchase soon.
For every person buying a Mac mini today for living room entertainment instead of an Apple TV (Apple makes more money on each sale), there is a potential for that same person to add an Apple TV in the near future to extend the entertainment to a den or bedroom. The living room Mac mini becomes the entertainment server for the whole house.
___________________________________________
If all of a sudden Apple were to receive a few hundred requests for an updated Mac mini on http://www.apple.com/feedback, maybe they would see the demand and respond by releasing an update.
“What’s going on – if anything – with Apple’s Mac mini?”
Well, nothing. It’s the same underpowered and limited expansion-capable machine it always was. The mini, the best high-tech paperweight ever invented. Way to go, Steve!
Santa Rosa isn’t much of a jump over the current C2D systems anyway. Penryn will be the one to wait for.
It tried to duck from sight but someone slipped it a mickey. Pretty goofy, I’d say.
Hey Peabody,
Use your time machine to go back to the G4 lampshade iMac, they came with 15″ screens.
Also …
love that comment “in my experience, recent college grads are universally self-indulgent, arrogant morons who can’t wipe their asses properly without assistance.”
I don’t think the machine needs to be refreshed constantly like other product lines. It is not meant for us on these boards. It is meant for cheap, PC owners to convert without feeling the pinch. If we have one, it is usually as a second or third Mac with a specialized role. Of course it needs to be refreshed but not in major ways. Perfect for my parents looking for their first Mac.
I am a fan of the mac mini idea – entry level Mac, small size, cute – but I have to admit that I have been waiting until they upgrade it to the Core 2 Duo. I just feel like it was not going to hold up long term from a technology perspective. All it takes is an operating system upgrade, newer programs optimized for 64 bit and I’d be left behind.
This may seem ridiculous to many. I mean, it’s inexpensive enough that I could get something new when I run into this, but I still would like to make a new purchase last for 5 years.
It’s good to hear that FOJIMO is using it successfully as a media server for his Apple TV, and that MOO is getting 1080p out of it. I had doubts about both.
“Apple does not like this model”
Incorrect. Apple is quite aware of how well the Mini serves to expand their customer base.
-jcr
Shawn
I think the Mac mini needs to be refreshed for those people using it for a livingroom entertainment device. Especially, with an improved graphics card, and 802.11n networking.
For entry level computing, or for PC switchers, it is fine the way it is; but should be cheaper.
This is ridiculous. The Mac Mini is a fantastic model and it is a real shame Apple is apparently refusing to make a core 2 duo model. My parents could use a new computer; I would get them a Mac Mini in heart beat if apple would just update it. Not that they really need the extra power of core 2, but it would be much more future proof if the mini had it, and their is no good reason why Apple doesn’t just put it in.
I don’t see why they would be afraid of Mac Mini hurting sales of iMac and Apple TV. These are all very distinct product lines, appealing to people with different needs at different price ranges. The decision is mostly a matter of what display the user wants: built in, their old display, or living room TV. All three options appeal to different people. Apple should just let the user choose the mac that’s right them, instead artificially controlling it by using outdated chips.
TO: United States of Generica
I agree. Something really Apple like, aka totally new form would be cool. Or a tiny-ass tower.
My absolute favourite would be Cube. They should bring it back.
It’s just the best looking Mac ever.
The target audience for the mini is non-techies who check email and post to my space. Not power users or intermediate users.
The mini’s audience does not know about the latest greatest chipsets or integrated video cards. They get a blank look on their face when you begin talking about those things.
The mini is fine as it is, it does what it is intended to do. Eventually-when the new chips are out and priced right-the mini will be updated.
Been using a G4 mini hooked to a 42″ DLP. Watch TV, surf and play emulated games – at the same time. Need to upgrade so I can watch a movie too. I bought it and a G5 iMac the same day – they were less than the PowerMac I was looking at.
The mini is my favorite. Really looking for a Core 2 Duo to take the Intel plunge. Maybe October with Leopard.
I think the target audience for the Mini is the vast hordes of Windows victims who have come to be dependent on yet terrified of computers and don’t want to spend a lot more of their precious moolah on something they (quite reasonably) have come to expect will be nothing but an endless headache.
“I know that computers are bad and crash all the time, but this one is sort of cute, and I can stick it in the corner there, out of the way, and my old one (two years old, in fact) has gotten terribly slow for some reason, and even though this ‘Mac’ thing will probably be bad and crash all the time too, at least I can still use my old screen, and then maybe I can make some of those nice slideshows and stuff, like Larry, and, heck, he might even stop bugging me with his incessant ‘get a Mac’ mantra every time I ask him to fix my stupid computer.”
One thing to remember: Apple is *very* careful about inventory control. I believe when the current inventory of minis gets low enough, they will issue an update.
Apple doesn’t like to have high levels of inventory languishing around – it’s not profitable.
If there is an abundance of mini’s it is because few people want them. Apple should simply donate them to a third world nation and take a tax write off.
You can gage the customer acceptance of the mini by looking at their prices on the used market. I’ve been looking for an affordable G4 mini, but they’re still holding their value quite well….
-hh
This story is stupid. The Mini is no threat to Apple TV, the MacBook, iMac or any other Apple product. This is so obvious it shouldn’t have to be explained. Further, no significant R&D resources are needed to refresh the Mini. What’s happening is very simple: 1. the margins and sales volumes have been good enough that no refresh has been necessary until now. 2. Apple hasn’t wanted to reinforce the expectation that refreshes are joined at the hip to the product cycle of Intel (Apple is “above” that). 3. Apple hasn’t wanted to spark a “so what” response to a refresh that happens on its own, as opposed to just one of several things that happen at roughly the same time. The refresh will come, and soon. Trust me. It will just come along with more major announcements.
Is there any source of Apple product breakdown in terms of overall Apple sales by specific product? What are the quarterly dollar figures for each Mac model: Mac Pro, iMac, Macbook Pro, Mac Book, Mac mini, etc.?
If the Mac mini represents a very small percentage of Apple’s total computer sales; that would explain why they do not see a need for a timely update.
We use a mini for the wife and kids computer – it is a workhorse. It ALSO has a small footprint paired with a low and wide monitor fits in the space an iMac would not.
I won’t by an iMac.
I think larry turnauer and others here are unfairly stereotyping Mac Mini users. A lot of mac enthusiasts and intermediate users get a lot of joy out of the Mac Mini. It’s G4 and Core Duo models are pretty powerful, very capable computers, especially at the time of their releases (I just wouldn’t run Final Cut Pro or Half-Life 2 on it.)
In terms of power, they can go toe to toe, and are typically better, then the average desktop computer.
The Mac Mini the perfect desktop for anyone who does not do multimedia production or gaming.
Couldn’t disagree with you more. There is NO option for a second monitor. Additionally, in my business, I need a large desktop and one 20-inch display is too little space. A 2.40 GHz Core 2 Duo with 800 MHz bus and the capacity for two 24-inch or one 30-inch monitor would be perfect.
What exactly do you do that requires two displays? Not that I don’t believe you, I’m just curious where outside of media production does that come in handy.
This story is bogus, of course Apple are not going to get rid of the mac mini, i can see them changing it but not getting rid. I am expecting the new refresh of the mini to be announced within the next 7 days. I would like to see a slightly larger form factor, the same hight but wider would be nice, Expected features would be Core 2 Duo, better graphics, HDMI, the improved version of front row that is in the AppleTV, Wireless N, larger HD.
What would be nice in a model to go on sale next month would be the ability to add a Blueray player at some stage (or now!), a separate graphics card with a DVI out as well as the HDMI, and a free upgrade to Leopard rather then asking users to fork over cash for an OS that will be end of line in a matter of months. If this were the case i would buy this tomorrow and put my Intel mac mini to other uses.